'Rogue States' and the United States of America

[qsaark]

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As per wikipedia, “Rogue state is a term applied by some international theorists to states considered threatening to the world's peace. This means meeting certain criteria, such as being ruled by authoritarian regimes that severely restrict human rights, sponsor terrorism, and seek to proliferate weapons of mass destruction.”

The term ‘rogue states’ itself is not an internationally recognized term. It is not a term that is used by the United Nations. This very term is only used by the United States and her allies to gain political and strategically goals.

Presently considered “rogue states” by the United States are (i) Iran and (ii) Sudan. States formerly considered "Rogue States" by the United States are (i) Cuba, (ii) Iraq, (iii) North Korea, (iv) Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, (v) Libya, (vi) Syria, and (vii) FR Yugoslavia.

Since this is a term that is coined and extensively used by the United States of America, we would have to analyze the United States of America whether it has been never been involved the activates needed to label a state as ‘rogue’ state or not.

Criterion 1. Ruled by authoritarian regimes:

What is an authoritarian regime? “Authoritarianism describes a form of government characterized by an emphasis on the authority of state in a republic or union. It is a political system controlled by typically non-elected rulers who usually permit some degree of individual freedom”. Please note the underlined “typically non-elected rulers”. The definition does not ‘exclude’ the elected rulers. Now let’s see if the Unites States Government is NOT an authoritarian regime.

“Hallmarks of totalitarian regimes have always included excessive reliance on secrecy, the deliberate stoking of fear in the general population, a preference for military rather than diplomatic solutions in foreign policy, the promotion of blind patriotism, the denial of human rights, the curtailment of the rule of law, hostility to a free press and the systematic invasion of the privacy of ordinary people”.

--Bob Herbert

The indications of authoritarianism in the United States:

1. Presidential veto powers
2. Market fundamentalism
3. Religious fervor embraced by the US Government
4. Destruction of critical education as a foundation for an engaged citizenry and a vibrant democracy
5. Militarization of public life

Please read this fine article by Henry A. Giroux here: (DV) Giroux: The New Authoritarianism in the United States

Criterion 2. Severely restrict human rights:

Lets have a look what the Amnesty International says about the human rights record of the Unites States of America:

“The US authorities continued to hold hundreds of foreign nationals at the US Naval Base in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, although more than 100 were transferred out of the facility during the year. Detainees in Guantánamo were held indefinitely, the vast majority of them without charge, and effectively without recourse to the US courts to challenge the legality of their detention. Most detainees in Guantánamo were held in isolation in maximum security facilities, heightening concerns for their physical and mental health. The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) programme of secret detention and interrogation was re-authorized by President Bush in July. In December, the Director of the CIA revealed that the agency had destroyed videotapes of detainee interrogations.

Soldiers refusing to serve in Iraq on grounds of conscience were imprisoned. Prisoners continued to experience ill-treatment at the hands of police officers and prison guards. Dozens of people died after police used tasers (electro-shock weapons) against them. There were serious failings in state, local and federal measures to address sexual violence against Native American women. Discrimination remained a concern in a variety of areas, including policing practices, the operation of the criminal justice system and housing rights. There were 42 executions during the year. In late September, the decision of the Supreme Court to review the constitutionality of lethal injections led to a de facto moratorium on executions by this method. In December, New Jersey became the first US state in more than four decades to legislate to abolish the death penalty.”

Full report here: Human rights in USA 2008

Criterion 3. Sponsor terrorism:That is my most favorite.

A. Korean War: 25 June 1950 to 27 July 1953.

Motive: To stop the spread of communism
Results: Inconclusive
Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.5 Million

B. Vietnam War: 1959 to30 April 1975

Motive: To stop the spread of communism
Results: North Vietnamese Victory. Eventual communist takeover of South Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos.
South Vietnamese civilian dead: 1,581,000
Cambodian civilian dead: ~700,000
North Vietnamese civilian dead: ~2,000,000
Laotian civilian dead: ~50,000

C. Support of Polpot Regime in Cambodia: 1975–1979

Motive: Unknown
Results: Inconclusive
Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.0 Million

D. First Gulf War: 2 August 1990 – 28 February 1991 (officially ended 30 November 1995)

Motive: To liberate Kuwait.
Results: Kuwait liberated.
Saddam Hussein remains in power
Imposition of sanctions against Iraq
Heavy Iraqi casualties and destruction of Iraqi and Kuwaiti infrastructure
Internal rising against Saddam Hussein brutally suppressed
Establishment of US military presence in Saudi Arabia
Palestinian Expulsion from Kuwait
Total civilians killed/wounded: 3,664. Two millions as per LANCET due to the sanctions.

E. Second Gulf War (The Iraq War): March 20, 2003 – 2009 (ongoing)

Motive: WMDs. Regime Change.
Results: No WMDs found
Regime toppled
Total civilians killed/wounded: 1,339,711 as per LANCET May 2009.

These are few very obvious examples. I have omitted the continued intervention of the United States in the Latin America and in the other parts of the world.

Criterion 4. Seek to proliferate weapons of mass destruction (WMDs):

1. Gave the knowhow and material of making the Atomic Bomb to the United Kingdom
2. Provided the ICBMs, ALBMs, and SLBM to the United Kingdom, and Italy
3. Provided cruise missiles to United Kingdom, and Spain
4. Sold Chemical and Biological weapons to the Iraq
5. Accounts for more than two-thirds of foreign weapons including the WMDs sales in 2008. Please see the definition of the WMDs as per the US Code Title 18.2332a here: US CODE: Title 18,2332a. Use of weapons of mass destruction

Now, how seriously should we take the term ‘rogue state’ coined and extensively used by the United States of America?

[Patriot]

There is no doubt that US qualifies for this name.It's a country which has done mass destruction all over the world.Only Russia can be compared with US in this area but Russians are far more intelligent now then those soviet days and only wage war when required like Georgia war which they won in 2 days and then returned back.

[gambit]

Now, how seriously should we take the term ‘rogue state’ coined and extensively used by the United States of America?

Not very serious at all. Every single one of item listed is taken out of its proper historical, institutional and social context. They are designed to be inflammatory, nothing more.

[qsaark]

Not very serious at all. Every single one of item listed is taken out of its proper historical, institutional and social context. They are designed to be inflammatory, nothing more.

Would you mind enlightening the members on any one of the item listed in its proper historical, institutional and social context? Lets see where you want to start with. Should we start with Korean conflict or the Vietnam massacre, or what about the support for Pol Pot and his blood thirsty Khmer Rouge regime?

[gambit]

Would you mind enlightening the members on any one of the item listed in its proper historical, institutional and social context? Lets see where you want to start with. Should we start with Korean conflict or the Vietnam massacre, or what about the support for Pol Pot and his blood thirsty Khmer Rouge regime?

Sure...Take the nonsense about Native American...

There were serious failings in state, local and federal measures to address sexual violence against Native American women.

The proper context here is that if a crime happened on tribal territory, it is the responsibility of the tribal police to investigate and prosecute, not the federal government's or even the local sheriff. If a crime against any Amerind outside of tribal territory, then it is treated no different than any other crime against any other citizens.

Do not delude yourself that the tripe you hacked up is any serious attempt at discussion on the idea of a 'rogue state'.

[fhassan]

As per wikipedia, “Rogue state is a term applied by some international theorists to states considered threatening to the world's peace. This means meeting certain criteria, such as being ruled by authoritarian regimes that severely restrict human rights, sponsor terrorism, and seek to proliferate weapons of mass destruction.”

The term ‘rogue states’ itself is not an internationally recognized term. It is not a term that is used by the United Nations. This very term is only used by the United States and her allies to gain political and strategically goals.

Presently considered “rogue states” by the United States are (i) Iran and (ii) Sudan. States formerly considered "Rogue States" by the United States are (i) Cuba, (ii) Iraq, (iii) North Korea, (iv) Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, (v) Libya, (vi) Syria, and (vii) FR Yugoslavia.

Since this is a term that is coined and extensively used by the United States of America, we would have to analyze the United States of America whether it has been never been involved the activates needed to label a state as ‘rogue’ state or not.

Criterion 1. Ruled by authoritarian regimes:

What is an authoritarian regime? “Authoritarianism describes a form of government characterized by an emphasis on the authority of state in a republic or union. It is a political system controlled by typically non-elected rulers who usually permit some degree of individual freedom”. Please note the underlined “typically non-elected rulers”. The definition does not ‘exclude’ the elected rulers. Now let’s see if the Unites States Government is NOT an authoritarian regime.

“Hallmarks of totalitarian regimes have always included excessive reliance on secrecy, the deliberate stoking of fear in the general population, a preference for military rather than diplomatic solutions in foreign policy, the promotion of blind patriotism, the denial of human rights, the curtailment of the rule of law, hostility to a free press and the systematic invasion of the privacy of ordinary people”.

--Bob Herbert

The indications of authoritarianism in the United States:

1. Presidential veto powers
2. Market fundamentalism
3. Religious fervor embraced by the US Government
4. Destruction of critical education as a foundation for an engaged citizenry and a vibrant democracy
5. Militarization of public life

Please read this fine article by Henry A. Giroux here: (DV) Giroux: The New Authoritarianism in the United States

Criterion 2. Severely restrict human rights:

Lets have a look what the Amnesty International says about the human rights record of the Unites States of America:

“The US authorities continued to hold hundreds of foreign nationals at the US Naval Base in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, although more than 100 were transferred out of the facility during the year. Detainees in Guantánamo were held indefinitely, the vast majority of them without charge, and effectively without recourse to the US courts to challenge the legality of their detention. Most detainees in Guantánamo were held in isolation in maximum security facilities, heightening concerns for their physical and mental health. The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) programme of secret detention and interrogation was re-authorized by President Bush in July. In December, the Director of the CIA revealed that the agency had destroyed videotapes of detainee interrogations.

Soldiers refusing to serve in Iraq on grounds of conscience were imprisoned. Prisoners continued to experience ill-treatment at the hands of police officers and prison guards. Dozens of people died after police used tasers (electro-shock weapons) against them. There were serious failings in state, local and federal measures to address sexual violence against Native American women. Discrimination remained a concern in a variety of areas, including policing practices, the operation of the criminal justice system and housing rights. There were 42 executions during the year. In late September, the decision of the Supreme Court to review the constitutionality of lethal injections led to a de facto moratorium on executions by this method. In December, New Jersey became the first US state in more than four decades to legislate to abolish the death penalty.”

Full report here: Human rights in USA 2008

Criterion 3. Sponsor terrorism:That is my most favorite.

A. Korean War: 25 June 1950 to 27 July 1953.

Motive: To stop the spread of communism
Results: Inconclusive
Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.5 Million

B. Vietnam War: 1959 to30 April 1975

Motive: To stop the spread of communism
Results: North Vietnamese Victory. Eventual communist takeover of South Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos.
South Vietnamese civilian dead: 1,581,000
Cambodian civilian dead: ~700,000
North Vietnamese civilian dead: ~2,000,000
Laotian civilian dead: ~50,000

C. Support of Polpot Regime in Cambodia: 1975–1979

Motive: Unknown
Results: Inconclusive
Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.0 Million

D. First Gulf War: 2 August 1990 – 28 February 1991 (officially ended 30 November 1995)

Motive: To liberate Kuwait.
Results: Kuwait liberated.
Saddam Hussein remains in power
Imposition of sanctions against Iraq
Heavy Iraqi casualties and destruction of Iraqi and Kuwaiti infrastructure
Internal rising against Saddam Hussein brutally suppressed
Establishment of US military presence in Saudi Arabia
Palestinian Expulsion from Kuwait
Total civilians killed/wounded: 3,664. Two millions as per LANCET due to the sanctions.

E. Second Gulf War (The Iraq War): March 20, 2003 – 2009 (ongoing)

Motive: WMDs. Regime Change.
Results: No WMDs found
Regime toppled
Total civilians killed/wounded: 1,339,711 as per LANCET May 2009.

These are few very obvious examples. I have omitted the continued intervention of the United States in the Latin America and in the other parts of the world.

Criterion 4. Seek to proliferate weapons of mass destruction (WMDs):

1. Gave the knowhow and material of making the Atomic Bomb to the United Kingdom
2. Provided the ICBMs, ALBMs, and SLBM to the United Kingdom, and Italy
3. Provided cruise missiles to United Kingdom, and Spain
4. Sold Chemical and Biological weapons to the Iraq
5. Accounts for more than two-thirds of foreign weapons including the WMDs sales in 2008. Please see the definition of the WMDs as per the US Code Title 18.2332a here: US CODE: Title 18,2332a. Use of weapons of mass destruction

Now, how seriously should we take the term ‘rogue state’ coined and extensively used by the United States of America?

Good post.....would read again.

In criterion 3 you should add Israel, ie support of a terrorist state never mind terrorism.

[qsaark]

Do not delude yourself that the tripe you hacked up is any serious attempt at discussion on the idea of a 'rogue state'.

Only a couple of sentences from George Washington are sufficient to explain where you are coming from.

"However unimportant America may be considered at present…," said George Washington, "there will assuredly come a day, when this country will have some weight in the scale of Empires..." Washington also referred to the United States as "an infant empire." Reference: Maxims of Washington: political, social, moral and religious. by John Frederick Schroeder.

It is not you who is speaking and denying, it is the imperialistic mentality of yours that is speaking and denying the historical crimes your leaders and regimes have committed.

[gambit]

Good post.....would read again.

In criterion 3 you should add Israel, ie support of a terrorist state never mind terrorism.

It is a joke trying in vain to disguise itself as serious...For example...

The indications of authoritarianism in the United States:

1. Presidential veto powers

Since when is executive powers, veto or not, is a sign that a government is authoritarian? All chief executives, from a fast food franchise to a country, have at their disposal such 'veto' power. It is necessary. For the US President, the most visible exercise of veto power is when the US Congress, specifically the House of Representatives, give him a national budget he deemed inappropriate for the country. But for the US, the Congress have the power to override the President's veto by 2/3 majority, making the US President's veto power only half as powerful as usually thought.

Now compare this with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez ABUSE of presidential powers...

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/12/wo...s/12venez.html

“Let’s leave this clear,” Mr. Chávez said during a live broadcast of his Sunday television program. “Golf is a bourgeois sport,” he said, repeating the word “bourgeois” as if he were swallowing castor oil. Then he went on, mocking the use of golf carts as a practice illustrating the sport’s laziness.

So it is not enough that Chavez is intimidating opposition press but now he goes after -- Golf?

But nooooo...Venezuela under Chavez does not qualify as a 'rogue state' at all...

[gambit]

Only a couple of sentences from George Washington are sufficient to explain where you are coming from.

"However unimportant America may be considered at present…," said George Washington, "there will assuredly come a day, when this country will have some weight in the scale of Empires..." Washington also referred to the United States as "an infant empire." Reference: Maxims of Washington: political, social, moral and religious. by John Frederick Schroeder.

It is not you who is speaking and denying, it is the imperialistic mentality of yours that is speaking and denying the historical crimes your leaders and regimes have committed.

Twenty four Pakistani peacekeepers and several journalists were murdered in Somalia in a UN mission. It was the 'rogue state' US that sent in troops in trying to capture the Somali warlord who were responsible for their deaths. We tried to avenge the deaths of YOUR countrymen, ingrate.

[IceCold]

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Twenty four Pakistani peacekeepers and several journalists were murdered in Somalia in a UN mission. It was the 'rogue state' US that sent in troops in trying to capture the Somali warlord who were responsible for their deaths. We tried to avenge the deaths of YOUR countrymen, ingrate.

When the black Hawk went down, we did the same as well went there to rescue however never appreciated infact the movie black hawk down completely removed Pakistan's participation from the rescue.