India's spy satellite all set to keep a tab on Pakistan, China .

[godsavetheworld]

We will do anything to counter Indian move: Pakistan
Maqbool Malik | Published: April 21, 2009

ISLAMABAD — The launch of first Indian spy satellite into the orbit to monitor borders with Pakistan has raised
many eyebrows and the development is likely to have adverse impact on terror war as well as strategic balance
in South Asia.
Well-placed government sources told TheNation that India’s Monday move has been taken by Islamabad as a
pinch of salt and would seek to balance out the situation with counter plans come what may.
“In the interest of peace, India should have delayed its satellite-based spying mission on Pakistan that is
currently engaged in fighting terror on its western border,” a senior official said requesting anonymity.
“Since both the South Asian nuclear neighbours, India and Pakistan, always had tense relations because of
Kashmir dispute, this development would add new dimension to their already estranged relations”, a leading
defence analyst said.
He was of the view that Pakistan cannot remain insensitive to this development and would also like to follow the
suit to boost its surveillance capability.

Pakistan had also launched a space research programme in late 80s and little progress has been made ever since.

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-ne...o-counter-move

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

Ofcourse! Havent you being doing that for the last 60 years?
Its one thing to operate your own satellite, its another to seek intel from others. Also China prefers to stay away from taking sides in an Indo-Pak Scenario. So its unlikely China will assist you in a way, US assisted Britain in WWII.

Its very simple you guys have been transferring the russian tech also like in case of barhamos.
China is a trustable aly of Pakistan and it has helped us through all our kith and kins. In case of India it has always helped us.

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

Frankly, I don't think Pakistan even has a need to have a spy satellite.

Oh we surely need it now . To lookout both of our westren and eastren borders.

[Gabbar]

China is a trustable aly of Pakistan and it has helped us through all our kith and kins.

Dont want ot burst your bubble but where was China during 1971 conflict?

[gpit]

Originally Posted by godsavetheworld

I never said that, I said China wont take visible sides in an Indo-Pak Scenario, which means no I-will-fight-for-my-dear-friend like UK and US.

Chinese are not as secretive. The biggest open secret is the fact that China cultivated Pakistan's N-bomb.

The A-bomb story is only alleged by US. Neither China nor Pakistan admits that. There still lacks hard evidences. Legally, it remains largely as an unsettled allegation.

UK and US story has a subtle background. US gained hugely by engaging itself in WWII. It’s not for free. Please read more on this.

If India keeps its hostile position against China (in addition to against other neighboring countries), it’s a no-brainer what position China will take. Be it overtly or covertly, don’t you think it fits Chinese AND Pakistani national interests all perfectly? This is why, from a neutral stand, I keep talking that it is in India’s best national interest to make China your friend. If you assert that those unsettled issues are already settled, then let’s wish a best luck to the orchid with its head buried.

[gpit]

Originally Posted by Gabbar

You are bang on. Hypothetically speaking, what if China decided not to sell any weapons to Pakistan and stop co-oprating of joint ventures, what does Pakistan has to lean back on? India is learning it's lessons now for relying too much on Russians. Price jacking up, after signing TOT then not delivering, lack of spare parts etc. You have to develop you own industry and research facility for self reliance.

You seem to lack the knowledge of ground reality, buddy.

Their interests are overlapping on vast areas, thanks to a hostile India! You can’t deny that because of China you dare not (even try to) run over Pakistan, now or before (in 1971).

As a matter of fact, in early 1950s, China was in suspicion that India would join Western camp by allying with Pakistan, which Nehru pledged to China that India would not to. (CIA documents)

Originally Posted by Gabbar

Dont want ot burst your bubble but where was China during 1971 conflict?

As I said 100 times, China viewed 1971 East-West Pakistan crisis as Pakistan internal matters (perhaps aggravated by RAW/India evil activities). China did not recognize Bangladesh until West Pakistan recognized it. China, as its doctrine stands, will not interfere with another sovereign country’s internal affaire, unlike India did imperialistically, for instance, towards Sikkim by invasion and occupation.

In 1971, China made a clear signal to world powers that (west) Pakistan’s independence must be preserved, hinting at India’s possible invasion by gathering of troops on its western front (US Department of State document). India finally cringed as China also prepared some troops along Sino-India boarders.

[gpit]

Originally Posted by malaymishra123

India had access to Russian satellites. Does that mean we dont need one of our own either? What kind of a logic is that?

Loosing an India does no harm to Russia. Russia can definitely afford it. Thus, Russia can either sell satellite information to you at a ridiculously higher price or not sell at all.

Loosing an independent Pakistan does a lot more harm to China, 1) China’s west front is sealed; 2) as it will wet the neo-imperialist’s appetite fervently, causing it attempts to stir more trouble around it.

You must have heard the word “friendship price”, which does not exist in Russian dictionary. Never!

If other much higher priorities have been handled, Pakistan of course can do whatever it like with remaining resources.

[afriend]

Originally Posted by gpit

As I said 100 times, China viewed 1971 East-West Pakistan crisis as Pakistan internal matters (perhaps aggravated by RAW/India evil activities). China did not recognize Bangladesh until West Pakistan recognized it. China, as its doctrine stands, will not interfere with another sovereign country’s internal affaire, unlike India did imperialistically, for instance, towards Sikkim by invasion and occupation.

Chinese and indian government have recogonised the that sikkim and tibet as part of india and china respectively..!!! So your comments are really hypocratic..!!!

[godsavetheworld]

Originally Posted by gpit

Loosing an India does no harm to Russia. Russia can definitely afford it. Thus, Russia can either sell satellite information to you at a ridiculously higher price or not sell at all.

Loosing an independent Pakistan does a lot more harm to China, 1) China’s west front is sealed; 2) as it will wet the neo-imperialist’s appetite fervently, causing it attempts to stir more trouble around it.

Thts a poor reason. Friendship is not as "mutuallly benificial" as Pakistan stands to gain not China. China has no interest in the middle east. It is repeatedly been proved by first the N-bomb, then the BM's, Pakistan's want for a similar Nuke deal, and something as recent as giving Chinese a clean cheque to deal with India. Now any strong sovereign country would fight its battle by itself.


Russia on the contrary has immensely to gain from India. And the biggest thing is the huge market for Russian goods, lucrative energy/ power contracts and several infrastructure development projects. With India's growing say in world affairs, and sooner than later veto power in UNSC. Russia has a lot to gain and offer. To add to this, India is contributing $5bn dollar in assisting development in Chechnya.

In the field of Science & Technology, Russia has enourmous gains. India has the brains to revolutionize this century. Cooperation is yielding outstanding results, eg Su-30mki, Brahmos, Pak-FA . All have been 50-50 ventures and have yielding outstanding results, and currently hold several milestones in their respective fields.

As I said 100 times, China viewed 1971 East-West Pakistan crisis as Pakistan internal matters (perhaps aggravated by RAW/India evil activities). China did not recognize Bangladesh until West Pakistan recognized it. China, as its doctrine stands, will not interfere with another sovereign country’s internal affaire, unlike India did imperialistically, for instance, towards Sikkim by invasion and occupation.

In 1971, China made a clear signal to world powers that (west) Pakistan’s independence must be preserved, hinting at India’s possible invasion by gathering of troops on its western front (US Department of State document). India finally cringed as China also prepared some troops along Sino-India boarders

[/QUOTE]

In 1962, US was ready to N-bomb China, for India.

In 1971, US asked China to menace India because it was worried that if India took over west Pakistan, USSR will have complete say in Asia, US itself sent Task force 74 that comprised of 2 destroyers and one Nuke vessel (USS Enterprise), to counter that Soviet Union sent 2 Nuke vessels, 8 destroyers, 1 nuke sub and said that if the situation of Indian conflict with China/USA rises, it would take "drastic counter measures" [Again CIA documents]. After this US vessels immediately returned and Chinese withdrew their troops.

After failing here, US and China tried to move UNSC for ceasefire twice, and twice USSR vetoed the resolution . Result? Pakistan never got the help it was assured from Beijing, and India was successful in its aim and won the war, yielding a new dimension to Indo-Soviet Relationship..

[IceCold]

Originally Posted by godsavetheworld

Balance of power shifting tremendously: Pakistan MNA

⋅ Wednesday, April 22nd, 2009 ⋅
ISLAMABAD (SANA): Israel backed Indian spy satellite aimed at surveillance of Pakistan nuke.
It is pertinent to mention that India sent its spy satellite in the space with the cooperation of Israel and the National Assembly (NA) termed it as threat to nuclear assets of the country.

Minister of State for Defence Sardar Saleem Haider Khan assured the house that he would inform the government’s view after taking briefing from the related institutions.

Speaking on point of order, MNA Palwasha Khan said that Indian aggressive motives were increasing as it sent spy satellite in the space to control the nuke assets of Pakistan.

She further stated that the power of balance was deteriorating and the government should inform that whether it was changing its space system to counter the Indian steps.


SOUTH ASIAN NEWS AGANCY (SANA) | India wants control over Pak nuke

Originally Posted by godsavetheworld

We will do anything to counter Indian move: Pakistan
Maqbool Malik | Published: April 21, 2009

ISLAMABAD — The launch of first Indian spy satellite into the orbit to monitor borders with Pakistan has raised
many eyebrows and the development is likely to have adverse impact on terror war as well as strategic balance
in South Asia.
Well-placed government sources told TheNation that India’s Monday move has been taken by Islamabad as a
pinch of salt and would seek to balance out the situation with counter plans come what may.
“In the interest of peace, India should have delayed its satellite-based spying mission on Pakistan that is
currently engaged in fighting terror on its western border,” a senior official said requesting anonymity.
“Since both the South Asian nuclear neighbours, India and Pakistan, always had tense relations because of
Kashmir dispute, this development would add new dimension to their already estranged relations”, a leading
defence analyst said.
He was of the view that Pakistan cannot remain insensitive to this development and would also like to follow the
suit to boost its surveillance capability.

Pakistan had also launched a space research programme in late 80s and little progress has been made ever since.

Pakistan to counter move | Pakistan | News | Newspaper | Daily | English | Online

This is typical and was expected however i don't expect anything beyond that now as long as PP is in the government. Also we can't develop a satellite in days to counter India's and nor can we develop an ASAT that quickly. All these things take time and that is if once the GOP gives a go head which unfortunately wont happen.

[IceCold]

Originally Posted by godsavetheworld

Thts a poor reason. Friendship is not as "mutuallly benificial" as Pakistan stands to gain not China. China has no interest in the middle east. It is repeatedly been proved by first the N-bomb, then the BM's, Pakistan's want for a similar Nuke deal, and something as recent as giving Chinese a clean cheque to deal with India. Now any strong sovereign country would fight its battle by itself.

You couldn't be more wrong then this and the example of 71 does not fit in. If it wasn't because of China who issued a thread, India would have attacked west Pakistan as well because we were not in any position to defend.
Moreover if China would have nothing to gain from Pakistan, the kind of relationship we have with China would have never gone that far, however interests vary from being totally strategic to economics. We provide both.
This is not the thread however feel free to open a separate thread and i would be glad to enlighten you on the issue "how Pakistan is equally important to China and vice-verse"

[abrakadabra]

Originally Posted by IceCold

India would have attacked west Pakistan as well because we were not in any position to defend.

India may have been in a postion to "occupy" west Pakisthan in 1971. But did it have the capability to govern the same? No. Never.

Pakisthan is not a piece of Land. Its many Million of people (I do not know how many Million was it in 1971). They are also the people who separated from India because Indian rule was unacceptable, and hence they will never agree to Indian rule in whatever form, and however it may come. That was the reason why India did not attack west Pakistan in 1971, and also why India returned some of the captured land to Pakistan in an earlier war (even though Pakistan did not eturn the same favour).

[IceCold]

Originally Posted by abrakadabra

India may have been in a postion to "occupy" west Pakisthan in 1971. But did it have the capability to govern the same? No. Never.

Pakisthan is not a piece of Land. Its many Million of people (I do not know how many Million was it in 1971). They are also the people who separated from India because Indian rule was unacceptable, and hence they will never agree to Indian rule in whatever form, and however it may come. That was the reason why India did not attack west Pakistan in 1971, and also why India returned some of the captured land to Pakistan in an earlier war (even though Pakistan did not eturn the same favour).

The objective was never to capture land, it was to destroy Pakistan's war machine and to give it such a devastating blow that it would never be able to return to its own foot ever again.

[was]

on aljazeera they said is israeli built haha

[godsavetheworld]

Originally Posted by IceCold

You couldn't be more wrong then this and the example of 71 does not fit in. If it wasn't because of China who issued a thread, India would have attacked west Pakistan as well because we were not in any position to defend.
Moreover if China would have nothing to gain from Pakistan, the kind of relationship we have with China would have never gone that far, however interests vary from being totally strategic to economics. We provide both.

The thing China gains is nothing except strategic edge. Pakistan and China have both common enemy. Its that simple. The last it does is help uplift Chinese economy the way is helps Pakistan's economy. Ironically, China's largest trade partner in Asia and Europe combined is India,and its sole enemy in Asia and Europe combined is also India.

This is not the thread however feel free to open a separate thread and i would be glad to enlighten you on the issue "how Pakistan is equally important to China and vice-verse

Now we can all thank gpit for succesfully derailing the thread, once again.