India Builds the Largest Tank Force in Eurasia

[Contrarian]

---

---

India Builds the Largest Tank Force in Eurasia

December 10, 2007: India has bought another 347 Russian T-90S tanks, at a cost of $3.5 million each. India is also building another thousand T-90S tanks under license, and using many parts imported from Russia.

Last year, India adopted the Russian T-90 as its new main battle tank. There will be local production of about a thousand T-90s over the next 14 years. India already has imported 310 T-90s. Under this plan, by 2020, India will have 2,000 upgraded T-72s, over 1,500 T90s, and few hundred other tanks. This will be the most powerful armored force in Eurasia, unless China moves ahead with upgrades to its tank force. The border between China and India is high in the Himalayan mountains, which is not good tank country. India's tank force is mainly for use against Pakistan.


The T-90 is a highly evolved T-72. Originally, the T-190 was done as a fall-back design. The T-80 was supposed to be the successor to the T-72. But like the T-62 and T-64 before it, the T-80 didn't quite work out as planned. So the T-72, with a much improved turret and all manner of gadgets, was trotted out as the T-90. Weighting 47 tons, it's 23 feet long, 11 feet wide and 7.5 feet high. Same package, better contents. And with well trained crews, it could be deadly.


India doesn't have to worry about facing M-1s. The main enemy is Pakistan, which has T-72s, a few T-80s and many older T-55s (the Chinese version.) Training remains a problem for the Indian army, because of rising fuel costs. Again, it's all relative, for the Pakistanis are even less able to pay for the vast quantities of fuel needed to move a tank around for training.


Currently, fuel alone costs the Indian army about a dollar per kilometer traveled by each for T-72s, and a little more for T-90s. So if you want to take a hundred T-72s out for several days of training, each vehicle is going to travel, say, 200 kilometers. That's $20,000 just for the fuel. Do that four times a year, for the entire 4,000 tank force, and you're out nearly $3 million. That's for minimal training, and many countries cannot afford even that. You can more than double the fuel cost to take care of replacement parts and repairs for accidents.


American armored vehicles cost from $15-$25 per kilometer to operate, largely because of higher personnel costs. This is why, even when poor nations get first rate tanks, they often do poorly in combat. Buying the tank, for a few million dollars each, is only a small part of the total cost of creating a competent crew to get the most out of that high tech tank.

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htp.../20071210.aspx

Its strategypage..take it with a pinch of salt!

[IceCold]

Its strategypage..take it with a pinch of salt!

I was going to reply till i read the last line. lol

[mujahideen]

I was going to reply till i read the last line. lol

Same hear.

[hoodhood1]

It is a known fact that these Tanks will be used against Pakistan. Against China, India will use it's Mountain Division and "Bofor" field guns.

[Vinod2070]

Such a waste. I hope it was not required.

[KENT]

Definetly, we definetly need Tank forces which low in number, but which much more swift in offence and retalition. Having large tank force will not going to work, as larger Inventory only needed in times of longer duration of war. In current geo-political scenario, only small degree of conflict is possible, we need to swift weapons which can give knockout blow, and turn result in our favour.

[Vinod2070]

Kent, with the current state of mutual suspicions and possible hostility, I agree that India needs to invest in tanks. But it is not useful in any other context, not in a Indo-China context to the same degree.

There is just so much and growing asymmetry between India and Pakistan that I wish the relations can become more realistic and less hostile and India and Pakistan can start focussing on their other issues.

It will mainly involve the countries feeling less threatened by each other. Pakistan can live with this asymmetry with China, the same may be possible with India. The difference is it considers China as a friend.

India is inevitably breaking out of the SA straight-jacket and needs to prepare for whatever responsibilities come with that role.

[KENT]

Kent, with the current state of mutual suspicions and possible hostility, I agree that India needs to invest in tanks. But it is not useful in any other context, not in a Indo-China context to the same degree.

There is just so much and growing asymmetry between India and Pakistan that I wish the relations can become more realistic and less hostile and India and Pakistan can start focussing on their other issues.

It will mainly involve the countries feeling less threatened by each other. Pakistan can live with this asymmetry with China, the same may be possible with India. The difference is it considers China as a friend.

India is inevitably breaking out of the SA straight-jacket and needs to prepare for whatever responsibilities come with that role.

Your thought are definetly admirable, but I am sorry to say whatever you have presented yourself is relating to geo-politics. I urge you to maintain yourself on topic, otherwise it will not take much in covesion this thread in any other INDIA vs China-Pakistan.

I hope you would understand me.

[Vinod2070]

Yep, I do. Thx.

[Astra]

The spending of tanks should not be considered as a waste, as it is adjusted well in the defence budget which is only 2.5% of GDP, while Pakistan spends 3.5% of GDP.

We do need a decisive edge both in the numbers and quality, to get the same decisive edge in case of a war. The Indian Army [Out of its vast experience] knows what it is doing. Remember, its important to 'Kill the will' of the enemy, which can be done only psychologically.

[KENT]

Wishing all Indian and pakitani as well as all others members of all other nationality a Very Happy New Year

[KENT]

The spending of tanks should not be considered as a waste, as it is adjusted well in the defence budget which is only 2.5% of GDP, while Pakistan spends 3.5% of GDP.

How does you arrive at this equation? seems to me quite spontenous calcuation indeed.

The Indian Army [Out of its vast experience] knows what it is doing. Remember, its important to 'Kill the will' of the enemy, which can be done only psychologically.

This particuler statement is completely way outside from what we have been discussing now.

[Astra]

How does you arrive at this equation? seems to me quite spontenous calcuation indeed..

Kent, get to know the facts before terming them as spontenous!
I expected you to know these figures, or atleast google before replying.

India GDP-$873 Billions-2006
Pakistan GDP $127 Billion- 2006

India defence budget
India- $21.3 Billions 2007= 2.43% of GDP
Pakistan-$4.8 Billions 2006=3.77% of GDP

Reference links:
::IDSA Strategic Comments:: The Indian Defence Budget 2007-08 ::
List of countries and federations by military expenditures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
List of countries by GDP (nominal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

This particuler statement is completely way outside from what we have been discussing now.

This is well within the contect of subject, as the reason for the large scale procurement. Your opinion differs.

[KENT]

So Lets rewind what was happen

The spending of tanks should not be considered as a waste, as it is adjusted well in the defence budget which is only 2.5% of GDP, while Pakistan spends 3.5% of GDP.

How does exactly the comparison of India and Pakistan's defence budget came into the equation in parallel to what India spends on Tank servicing and Maintenece?.

What were you trying to justify the expenses of our Tank in terms of GDP?

We do need a decisive edge both in the numbers and quality, to get the same decisive edge in case of a war. The Indian Army [Out of its vast experience] knows what it is doing. Remember, its important to 'Kill the will' of the enemy, which can be done only psychologically.

How does decisive edge in numbers and quality and vast experience of Indian army would translate into psycohological advantage in terms of 'Kill the will of the Enemy'?

[Astra]

---

---

So Lets rewind what was happen

How does exactly the comparison of India and Pakistan's defence budget came into the equation in parallel to what India spends on Tank servicing and Maintenece?.

What were you trying to justify the expenses of our Tank in terms of GDP?

First you question the calculation, and now the equation. What are you up to?

Yes, the expenditure is very much justified. Indian Military has top grade defence analysts who decide the requirements based on the threat perception, and you cannot call it waste. Do you think that the Indian military establishment is a pack of fools to place an order for 1000 T-90 tanks.

Point is, we are spending far less than our adversaries in terms of GDP, how do you call it a waste?. If we spend less towards development and allot more money for defence, then it would be waste. But this is well within the budget.

How does decisive edge in numbers and quality and vast experience of Indian army would translate into psycohological advantage in terms of 'Kill the will of the Enemy'?

Ofcourse, do you really want me to explain you this? Who would fight an enemy, when he knows that enemy is far well equiped. Would you fight a man with a gun, when you have only a knife. Most people won't.[Just to explain you]. When the fear factor comes in, performance is limited.

If you look from the other side, better equipment definetly boosts the confidence of a soldier.

Please stop arguing just for the sake of it.