just a thought, not an expert . . . .
just a thought, not an expert . . . .
Last edited by TaimiKhan; 07-28-2011 at 12:23 PM.
The ones coming on IL-78s used to be fully manufactured in China with the final assembly being done at Kamra to give experience to our guys before we start making our own ones.
And those IL-78s were of not PAF origin which we saw in those pics, rather they were of some transport company of Russia or other CAS country.
Any updates about the 50 JF-17 which were promised by China to be delievered in next 6 months.
If we get 50 JF-17 from China in next 6 months, and the third SQD become operational from PAF as well, then this deal will take to JF17's number 80+ in PAF fleet with minimum 6 SQD's
JF-17 Thunders: Pakistan to get 50 Chinese jets in six months
Pakistan hopes to take delivery within the next six months of 50 JF-17 fighter jets manufactured jointly with China, Defence Minister Ahmad Mukhtar said on Friday during a visit to Beijing.
Mukhtar made the comments on the sidelines of a meeting between Chinese President Hu Jintao and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani.
“We think there is a good deal,” said Mukhtar, who put the price of each JF-17, or Thunder, aircraft at $20-25 million “as compared to $80 million for the F16”, a US-built jet also used by the Pakistan Air Force (PAF).
Mukhtar did not explicitly state whether the deal had been finalised, but it appeared that the agreement was nearing completion.
Further details of the deal were not made public but the agreement was apparently discussed during the visit by Gilani.
Meanwhile, The Wall Street Journal originally quoted an unnamed high-ranking PAF spokesman, in Beijing with Gilani, as saying the jointly developed JF-17 jets would be in addition to another batch of the same aircraft that is currently being assembled in Pakistan.
China is one of Pakistan’s largest aircraft providers. The PAF has a fleet of Chinese aircraft, including F-7PGs and A-5s. The JF-17 “Thunder” programme dates back to 1999 and is aimed at reducing Pakistan’s dependence on Western companies for advanced fighters.
The jets are a single-engine, multi-role combat aircraft, which Mukhtar said are being jointly produced between China and Pakistan.
“There was a loan given for starting the manufacturing of this because the Chinese will also buy these aircraft,” he said on Chinese financing for the order.
The Pakistani Air Force has ordered 150 “Thunders”, which it may increase to 250. The 50 mentioned in the report are likely part of the larger order. In February 2010, Pakistan fielded its first JF-17 squadron with 14 aircraft.
Published in The Express Tribune, May 21st, 2011.
Correction: May 21, 2011
The earlier headline of this article incorrectly called the JF-17 a stealth jet. The correction has been made.
but one more thing, pilots cant "jettison" missiles, they can also use BVR missiles, such as AIM-120 AMRAAM into dogfights. AIM-120 is capable of shooting down targets at very close range, i dont know about SD-10..
^^ Even S-10 too, earlier SD-10 seeker was based on R-77 which has the capability to immediately switch to on board radar mode for target acquisition in case it is deployed in short range. In fact all the BVRs have the same capability I feel.
Chinese forums and sources are already quoting the redesigned nose variant of JF-17 being tested, but for now no picture is available giving a clear view of this new variant.
In a few months time, the real view of this new variant would be clear and also what it is carrying.
chinese official media said that PL-5 EII was tested in pakistan last year before Farnborough Air show.
may be it is a new missile？？？？？
Last edited by houshanghai; 07-28-2011 at 07:48 PM.
data for: Pakistan Air Force fielded Xiaolong fighter.
July 25, according to Russian military news network reported that the British “Air Force Magazine,” July 2011 on an issue of up to 24-page article detailing China and Pakistan jointly developed the JF-17 “Lightning “/ FC-1″ Fierce Dragon “fighter, especially the history of research and development, project progress, structural characteristics, although the apparent color of subjective tendencies and advertising, but without losing the fun. Russian readers may also cause some interest, because the “Fierce Dragon” superior performance, the price is not high, the attractiveness of the larger developing countries, export prospects.
“Air Force Magazine,” that talking about the “Fierce Dragon” fighter project, can not ignore the fact that the Pakistan Air Force is involved in the development so far the only fighter. Pakistan Air Force Chief of Staff of Sulaiman stressed that this is Pakistan’s nuclear tests in 1998 were U.S. and European sanctions against the special circumstances of the decision. He said: “Sanctions and (using) the increase is the development of new aircraft, the main reason for replacing aging aircraft, and cooperation with China is the most sensible for us is the most economically favorable decision.”
JF-17 as a new generation of lightweight multi-functional fighter, in any weather conditions 24 hours a day fighting with. It uses the glass cockpit, with excellent ergonomics of the “hands on the bar” type flight control system can effectively reduce the pilot workload. “Fierce Dragon” maximum speed of 1.6 Mach, thrust-weight is relatively large, is an excellent fighter. As the Pakistan Air Force fighters after killing the target over the horizon do not have the ability, it has been possible to enhance and improve close air combat tactics, and reached a very high standard. According to unconfirmed information, in 2008, “Anatolian Eagle” exercise, the Pakistan Air Force F-16 aircraft results 3-0 win over Europe, “Typhoon” aircraft. Pakistan in the design of JF-17 without forget the full advantage of this air combat techniques, and using the Chinese developed a very advanced SD-10A medium-range air to air missiles, the fourth generation after the aircraft has been equipped with anti-air BVR goals. JF-17 can use the Chinese developed “Charlie-5E” short-range missiles and medium-range SD-10 air to air missiles, including the “Fierce Dragon” aircraft July 17, 2010 the first successful launch of “Charlie-5EII” missile, marking the entire aircraft project into a new and important phase. Prior to the Pakistan Air Force in April 2010 the “high standard” exercise, the “Fierce Dragon” has been fully demonstrated their ability to attack successfully throwing 500 pounds and 2000 pounds-level aerial bombs, hitting the target for the training venue.
Russian media noted that in 2010 the “Fierce Dragon” fighter extravaganza Farnborough Air Show air show before, many people are still the “Fierce Dragon” as a research and development need a lot of time of a conceptual product, not enough to enter the European fighter market leading products, but also have not tried with the European fighter “Typhoon”, “Gripen”, “gust”, or the U.S. aviation industry product F-15, F-16 or F-22 competition, to snatch the international market. As the “Fierce Dragon” the development side, Pakistan card Ratko Aviation Industry Group and China National Aero-Technology Import and Export Corporation would want this product to occupy a larger market share, after all, this is a 21st century modern fighters, the price much lower than similar products in the West, the performance is no less, and is equipped with very advanced systems. Pakistan believes that the “Fierce Dragon” to help the Near East, Middle East, Far East, Africa and Latin America to achieve their long-awaited air changes. If necessary, the CMB can be also introduced two versions of the “Fierce Dragon”, a number with a more affordable price, performance was no less of Chinese airborne radio equipment and weapons, a Western with a complex airborne radio equipment. In short, all by the client’s budget and needs. Many countries now have the “Fierce Dragon” very interested, after all, the aircraft cost-effective for many developing countries is a good choice.
Russian media said, “Xiaolong” R & D dates back to the late 1980s. In 1989 the grounds of the United States to Pakistan to develop nuclear weapons freeze 71 F-16 fighter delivery agreement, while prohibiting the Northrop – Grumman to help Pakistan develop a new generation fighter aircraft “over 7″, the Chinese F-7 aircraft the further development of model fighter. Since then Pakistan Air Force bitter experience, that as soon as possible to get rid of sanctions and endless blackmail the United States, decided to continue cooperation with China has independently developed light fighter. 1992 China and Pakistan signed the relevant agreement, agreed to three joint research project based fighter concept, the drafting of the new aircraft’s performance and operational requirements, and create the basis for the development of the Palestinian National aviation industry, joint efforts to promote new products to third countries. 1995 agreed on the specific requirements of the new aircraft, the Pakistan Air Force fighters and China signed a memorandum of understanding to set up a new office responsible for project implementation. 1996 Pakistan Air Force “Super 7″ fighter design is approved, two years after the Pakistani government signed a further agreement to implement the project-specific, the company decided to start with China as the production prototype to fly, code-named FC-1 “owl Long, “China to help train Pakistani Air Force pilots and engineers. Early in the project, the Palestinian side only 50% of the overall workload in the Pakistan Air Force to get 150 aircraft, will be one hundred percent by the Pakistani aviation sector is responsible for new aircraft production. But the United States and Europe in October 1999 because of India and Pakistan have conducted nuclear tests and the outbreak of armed conflict on bilateral sanctions, leading to “super 7″ project in trouble again, Western companies involved in the project can not get the necessary export licenses, so that China and Pakistan is facing many new technical problems. Pakistan Air Force then decided to use China-made system to be replaced, but the initial progress is not smooth. In November 2000 Pakistan Air Force Chief of Staff Ali – Mir important recommendations, the overall progress of the project that led to the slow flying airborne systems and separate R & D platform itself, for go hand in hand, hoping to end of the project overall R & D fighter, airborne radio-electronic equipment was to achieve a more advanced level. Ten years later proved that this decision is correct.
Russian media said the Pakistan Air Force after seizing every opportunity to actively study the ability to install a variety of aircraft equipment and systems. August 25, 2003 China to achieve a “super -7″ fighter’s first flight. Pakistan Air Force said its “super -7″ officially renamed the JF-17, the “Joint Fighter-17″, intended to reflect the aircraft’s Pakistani origin, the number “17″ means it is more than the Pakistan army was the most advanced F-16 also advanced. The first prototype flight in eight months after the April 9, 2004 test samples of the second frame machine PT-3 launch in Chengdu, the next day the Pakistan Air Force pilots flew the first flight. The end of 2006, the Pakistan Air Force has been testing four prototypes, the first five have started ground testing. PT-4 and PT-6 equipped with China’s radio-electronic equipment, including PT-4 August 2009 delivery on the Palestinian side, for flight certification in Pakistan, which became the basis of the JF-17 sample. After China re-design of JF-17 inlet, switch to non-separated Road supersonic inlet, the DSI using the most advanced technology to improve engine efficiency and reduce landing speed, reduced takeoff and landing roll distance, reducing the infrared radiation characteristics. This aircraft under adverse conditions of combat use is an important advantage, is the dream of Pakistan Air Force. At that time the only use of foreign aircraft in the United States similar to the inlet of the fifth generation fighter F-35.
in China in addition to the four prototype testing, the eight small-batch production of the “Fierce Dragon” all delivered in 2007-2008, the Palestinian side. Use the first two transport aircraft delivered in February 2007, Kamla, well after the March 2 assembly in Pakistan Aviation Industry Group completed its first flight, March 23 Pakistan finishing flag, took part in the Pakistan National Day military parade . After the first production aircraft type “Fierce Dragon” (No. 07-101) also use a special pattern, painted in national colors of Brazil, and still in use. February 18, 2010 Pakistan Air Force JF-17 fighter pilot squadron incorporated into the 26th Air Force, before April of that year with 12 “Fierce Dragon”, including the first flight of production aircraft. 26 unit responsible for assessing the “Fierce Dragon” flight performance testing airborne radio electronic equipment and weapons systems, training fleet pilots, most of them flying from the 7th Brigade, has experience serving in the air defense forces, driving the “Phantom IIIEA “or F-16 fighter, is rich in airborne radar using skills.
Russian media said the April 11, 2011 JF-17 project is completed another important phase of work. Pakistan Air Force 26th Air Force rotations to Peshawar, began to equip the new JF-17, all models of the future will be “Fierce Dragon” test. China and Pakistan prepared to “Fierce Dragon” throughout the service period of its five major modern improvements, priority is to install air refueling system, integrated infrared target acquisition and tracking system. Pakistan Aviation Industry Group is now the “Phantom” fighter install air refueling system, in order to master new technologies, gain the experience necessary to carry out similar to the JF-17 conversion work. Now the 26th Battalion priority for the new production of the “Fierce Dragon” fighter pilot training, but also for the Pakistani army is continuing significance of the airborne-ground weapons testing. Now weapons testing and other experiments are being conducted simultaneously. In order to ensure that the aircraft has a high operational effectiveness, “Fierce Dragon” equipped with a large number of various types of weapons systems, including conventional weapons and high-precision weapons, and the complex radio-electronic equipment and precision navigation system. In addition, the “Fierce Dragon” still in Chinese-made C-802 anti-ship missiles, the first phase of integration is expected to soon be tested. Advanced airborne radio electronic equipment to ensure the “Fierce Dragon” battlefield survivability, with aerial refueling capability to stay in the air after longer, with the border areas in Pakistan to implement any desired location against the ability to more effectively protect national security.
Pakistani aviation industry a few years to consider a variety of “Fierce Dragon” airborne radar configuration, including the Pakistan Air Force in the very popular Italian Grifo radar, had been in “Phantom”, F-7P, F-7PG aircraft. Pakistan must be specifically requested radar receiver is compatible with airborne weapons systems, to ensure that medium-range air to air missiles can be used. Although the aircraft was originally certified to debug and radio electronic equipment was used when the Grifo S radar, but the Pakistan Air Force or for the first eight small group of “Fierce Dragon” chose China’s independently developed KLJ-7 radar. This is a multi-standard Doppler radar, the main advantage is the compact, small size, search range, and advanced performance, high resolution, ideal for the “Fierce Dragon” fighter. JF-17 as the search target, the primary means to guide weapons, KLJ-7 radar, radio-electronic equipment by modern 1553/1760 interface and weapons systems integrated into a whole, and thus continue to enhance the performance of the aircraft have the potential to use both Chinese weapons, can use Western weapons, especially with China SD-10A air missile performance has increased significantly. In addition, the Pakistan Air Force is also considering using a similar medium-range missiles and Western airborne radio electronic equipment, to ensure that JF-17 become so frightened of enemy air defense platform.
Russian media said the first batch of 50 JF-17 aircraft, including eight in Chinese-made small batches, and the Palestinian side assembly 42 high-volume, full use of China airborne radio electronic equipment, plans in 2012 Pakistan Air Force in early delivery. The second batch of 50 JF-17 procurement contract was May 19, 2011 signed. Pakistan still hoping to get Western airborne radio electronic equipment, because the JF-17′s biggest advantage is that it’s fully open, and never confined to a single configuration. In addition, Pakistan plans to gradually put national industries in the “Fierce Dragon” co-production projects in the proportion increased to 80%, including Kamla assembled in China KLJ-7 airborne radar. Pakistan Air Force, a senior official said: “Two years ago I had the French said, if you do not help us, not to provide radio-electronic equipment, then we will let you believe that a few years the Chinese people can also create a similar device results they did. “The fact that the Pakistan Air Force will not want to get some equipment from one country to delay the” Fierce Dragon “fighter production, the Palestinian side on this issue is very real. Now, China and Pakistan are still actively selling to the international market, JF-17, particularly the use of MiG -21, F-7, F-5, “Mirage III”, “Phantom IV” of the country. “Fierce Dragon” has caused a high level of interest in many countries, this is not surprising, as it advanced, the price is not high, in line with cost-effective standards for most developing countries is a good choice.
Seems spelling mistake cause Palestinians have nothing do with it
IR (infra red) days are long gone . . . .
and one more thing it is also off-bore sight capable . . .
A good article on Chinese AAM . . .
Last edited by hatf IX; 07-28-2011 at 09:17 PM.
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