Mistrust of India Forges Sense of Unity in Pakistan

[asaad-ul-islam]

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They may be against India, But just your claim about finding armed militia everywhere signifies lawlessness and lack of GoP control There is nothing to be proud about that.

that's if india attacks, and especially if the govt. does not do anything about it. we won't wait to fight back, in an all-out war if necessary. now, I can say the same for india, we can find armed hindu extremists who are ready to kill their own people. just because your govt. backs them-modi, etc.- it does not mean your armed-militia are justified.

we can find hindu extremists who sponsor and coordinate mass genocide campaigns, rape women and burn fetus, and forcefull re-convert people into the fold of hinduism. we can find hindu extremists creeping their way into your armed forces, killing innocent people and ruining the peace process while your people scream bitterly against Pakistan.

only Allah knows how far these hindu extremists have infiltrated your govt. and probably even your intelligence agencies. I fear nuclear weapons may fall into the wrong hands...

[rubyjackass]

Everyone know what Indira Gandhi said after fall of east Pakistan,India still dont accept Pakistan

Really? she said so? I don't think so. Please give links to sources.

I fear nuclear weapons may fall into the wrong hands...

I can't help

[SurvivoR]

I wouldn't be surprised if they said bad things about Pakistan in the streets - who wouldn't?
Howver, that's not what brought them onto the streets in the first place. The focus of the rallies was to demand better governance and security from the government, and show solidarity with the victims and martyrs. These protesters were not ideologues/political workers - they were middle-class citizens....

They came out on streets due to one reason i.e inability of Indian government to provide them security.
It does not matter if Indians say bad things about Pakistan. When they did not say such things during last 61 years.?

Quite different from the rallies in Pakistan by religious groups, who were burning Indian, US and Israeli flags and shouting religious slogans...

When Muslims were killed in Gujrat Hindu rallies were also shouting religious slogans.

Pakistani and US flags are also burnt in India during rallies so is the practice of burning flags of different countries arround the world. Keepiong this in mind your comment is only reflecting intention to blam Muslims.

[Hawkeye]

Completely untrue. From the Indian media to the Prime Minister to the common man on the street, all we heard in the aftermath of the attacks was Pakistan, Pakistan, Pakistan, Pakistan, Pakistan. When Condolezza Rice came to visit, the questions all involved Pakistan. It doesn't matter if the people protesting were from the middle class, it was their inclination to dislike Pakistan which was the main feature of any kind of POV expressed by Indians after the attack.

Indeed it was Pak Pak Pak. But do you blame them ? From the common mans perspective, this is the country where armed anti indian groups operate freely, sometimes with covert help from insiders within the GOP / millatry establishment.

These groups have over the years been responsible for the deaths of thousands of security personel and civillians ( their families ? )

Successive Pak governments have used this anti india card to deflect from the state of the Pakistan economy and the realities that lie in their own backyard.

Few people realise therefore that there may be the well informed upright Pakistani citizen who has a voice of dissent here.

that's if india attacks, and especially if the govt. does not do anything about it. we won't wait to fight back, in an all-out war if necessary. now, I can say the same for india, we can find armed hindu extremists who are ready to kill their own people. just because your govt. backs them-modi, etc.- it does not mean your armed-militia are justified.

Accepted

we can find hindu extremists who sponsor and coordinate mass genocide campaigns, rape women and burn fetus, and forcefull re-convert people into the fold of hinduism. we can find hindu extremists creeping their way into your armed forces, killing innocent people and ruining the peace process while your people scream bitterly against Pakistan.

only Allah knows how far these hindu extremists have infiltrated your govt. and probably even your intelligence agencies. I fear nuclear weapons may fall into the wrong hands...

I would disagree here..... fortunately in India the Armed forces have no political strength and the influence of the Politicians is limited to only to a part of the millatry establishment. A clear mandate would be required from not just these but also the President - in the worst cast scenario.

My fears are actually reversed to Pakistan here - Here is a country where a patriotic and brilliant Scientist was made to take the fall for the deeds of a despot dictator and his band and their trading in this technology with unstable nations.

India is a nation where there has never been a leak on this technology ! I think this non proliferation was a great factor in deciding the Nuclear treaty with the US.

No my friend you need to rethink this.....

They came out on streets due to one reason i.e inability of Indian government to provide them security.
It does not matter if Indians say bad things about Pakistan. When they did not say such things during last 61 years.?

When Muslims were killed in Gujrat Hindu rallies were also shouting religious slogans.

Pakistani and US flags are also burnt in India during rallies so is the practice of burning flags of different countries arround the world. Keepiong this in mind your comment is only reflecting intention to blam Muslims.

This is not about Muslims / Hindus. To my best knowledge India has a almost the same number of Muslims as does Pak. It is about blaming the government ( which may not have played an active part ) which stood by and let extremists spread their evil.

[Hawkeye]

Again, I don't think Blains intent was to question which of the two crimes was 'more horrible' (assuming the perceived gross negligence on the part of the GoI counts as a crime), but to point out that the other (in this case Pakistan, and not the militants) became targets of outrage and ire, and therefore, 'rage at the other' became a unifying factor.

Many Pakistanis see India as a threat - a nation that sponsors terrorism in Pakistan and seeks to destabilize it. For the purposes of this discussion the validity of those perceptions is not important, but understanding that they exist is, because it explains why in the case of Pakistan the threat of war from India becomes a unifying factor that overrides the threat from the Taliban (a threat whose implications are not fully understood for various reasons by Pakistanis anyway).

Again, the whole point of Blains and my post was to suggest that 'fear of the other' in times if crises can be a unifying factor for people, but this doesn't mean that 'fear of the other' is the only unifying factor - since the thread seemed to be heading down the familiar road of the 'Pakistan's only reason for existence is hatred of India' canard.

Well said

It is important to note here that Indians conversely see Pakistan as a country that forments and abets terrorism. How about you making a post to find out the perspective as to what could be the measures to fix this mutual distrust ? Interesting thoughts may be thrown up.....

[Imran Khan]

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No military action against Pakistan: Manmohan assures Asfandyar
Updated at: 0400 PST, Thursday, December 18, 2008
ISLAMABAD: Indian High Commissioner to Pakistan, Satyabarata Pal Wednesday ruled out any possibility of military action against Pakistan following the Mumbai attacks.

He conveyed this message of Indian PM Manmohan Sigh during a meeting with ANP Chief and Chairman National Assembly Committee for Foreign Affairs, Asfandyar Wali Khan here at Pukhtoonkhwa House (former Frontier House), said a press release issued here.

He said that the Indian army had remained in their peace position and no troops movement towards the Indian-Pakistani border or LoC was being contemplated. He also recalled the Indian troops’ movement in the year 2002 in the aftermath of terrorist attacks in the Indian Parliament and said, “ it is not the case now.”

Pal said that the Indian government was satisfied from day one that the civil government in Pakistan was not involved in the attacks. He, however, emphasised mutual cooperation to fight terrorism in the region as both the countries were equally suffering.

He also emphatically denied any threatening call against Pakistan having been made from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of India. He said that during the past 61 years never a call has been made by any Indian minister to the President or Prime Minister of Pakistan, which would otherwise be against the norms of protocol.

The India High Commissioner requested Asfandyar Wali Khan to personally convey this message to President Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani. Earlier, the Indian High Commissioner along with the High Commission Counselor called on Asfandyar Wali Khan to enquire about his health and expressed relief on his narrow escape in a suicide attack at Wali Bagh.

He expressed condolences on the tragic killing of innocent persons including the personal servant Yar Zamin Khan and sympathized with their families. Central Additional Secretary General of ANP, Hasham Baber and Central Information Secretary Zahid Khan were also present in the meeting.

Both sides discussed the prevailing disturbed situation in the region and agreed that certain elements were bent upon derailing the peace process and rapprochement between India and Pakistan.

Asfandyar Wali Khan said that two generations of both sides of the divide have been indoctrinated to consider each other as enemies. Those apprehensions are so deep rooted that the smallest act of terrorism can cause to reverse the process of friendship to square one, he added.