Russia blocks sale of engines for Sino-Pak fighter jets

[dk33]

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Has there be any further news on the 'concerns' voiced by Russian manufacturers, and what decision the Russian government might take on exporting the RD-93 for re-export to the existing six approved nations?

Or are we still gassed up on that one set of quotes?

[amit27]

This is a business decision by Russia due to the competition posed by the JF17's low cost it is ideal for low income nations. How long can Russia stop these engines to China is another matter given the clout China enjoys today.

[BATMAN]

Ironic that outdated Mig-29's have been able to get kills against F-16's and F-18's in mock combat.

Can you please provide a link with the IAF cheif saying that?

Edit i found the quote, and it is nothing how you discribed it, as followed:

"Any aircraft is nothing but a khokha (shell), but what matters is what is inside it,"

He said nothing about the Mig-35 being an empty shell. You need to be careful with what you say this is the third time you have been dishonest.

By threatning you cannot change the facts.. it is you who is being dishonest when you say IAF cheif did not refer to mig-35.
whereas IAF cheif had made those comments for Mig-35 and at the same moment he also said that he is looking for an aircraft to win wars and not for aerobatics... which were performed by Mig-35.
he was asked question if the MRCA will go Russina way than he made that statement.

In previous posts, i said mig stumbled due to panic and i slipped with algeria instead of morroco a mistake but the fact is Morroco returned mig-29 after delivery saying its build quality is not up to mark and they bought F-16
How more worst can it be for the marketing of a product?

Never, i attempted to compare technical specs. of thunder vs mig. but you cannot stop when people at farnborough will only be comparing it with mig-29.

now i quote from defenceindia.com

India asks MiG to send RFP for 126 fighters: Tyagi

India has asked Russia's MiG aircraft corporation to send a request for proposal (RFP) for the acquisition of 126 fighters, IAF chief S P Tyagi said here.Tyagi, who watched a demonstration flight of the Mig-35 (Mig-29ovt) fighter at a Russian air force base near the capital told reporters that the demonstration was "brilliant", but clarified that the IAF was looking for an aircraft "to win wars" and not for "impressive demonstrations".

"Any aircraft is nothing but a 'khokha' (shell), but what matters is, what is inside it," the Air Chief Marshal underscored.He said that for the first time the factor of "life cycle cost or ownership cost" was being taken into account while acquiring a fighter."How to calculate the ownership cost was the problem and that's why it has taken more time in taking a decision," Tyagi said and added that the tender would be invited "very soon".

According to earlier reports, Russia's Mig-35 would be facing a tough challenge from the battle-proven US F-16 and F-18.

[amit27]

By threatning you cannot change the facts.. it is you who is being dishonest when you say IAF cheif did not refer to mig-35.
whereas IAF cheif had made those comments for Mig-35 and at the same moment he also said that he is looking for an aircraft to win wars and not for aerobatics... which were performed by Mig-35.
he was asked question if the MRCA will go Russina way than he made that statement.

In previous posts, i said mig stumbled due to panic and i slipped with algeria instead of morroco a mistake but the fact is Morroco returned mig-29 after delivery saying its build quality is not up to mark and they bought F-16
How more worst you can it be?

Never, i attempted to compare technical specs. of thunder vs mig. but you cannot stop when people at farnborough will only be comparing it with mig-29.

now i quote from defenceindia.com

build quality various on mig-29, It is true that Russia used low quality parts on the algerian migs but that doesent mean Russia has used low quality on all the migs it has produced.

[ptldM3]

By threatning you cannot change the facts.. it is you who is being dishonest when you say IAF cheif did not refer to mig-35.
whereas IAF cheif had made those comments for Mig-35 and at the same moment he also said that he is looking for an aircraft to win wars and not for aerobatics... which were performed by Mig-35.
he was asked question if the MRCA will go Russina way than he made that statement.

In previous posts, i said mig stumbled due to panic and i slipped with algeria instead of morroco a mistake but the fact is Morroco returned mig-29 after delivery saying its build quality is not up to mark and they bought F-16
How more worst you can it be?


Never, i attempted to compare technical specs. of thunder vs mig. but you cannot stop when people at farnborough will only be comparing it with mig-29.

I read his quote carefully, and he did say that aircraft don't win wars by performing impressive demonstrations, and he was correct. But what you did was manipulate his words by conveniently substituting "any aircraft" with "Mig-35", so it is you that is being dishonest. Look up the definition of "any" this can include anything or any aircraft.

I also fail to see how the Mig-35 can be an empty shell if it currently has technology that even the Typoon doesn't poses, atleast not something ready to go into full production.

[BATMAN]

I don't say mig-35 is any less.. i just quote an example how F-16 static display can influence airforces in dramtic fashion.
Any how.... you are free to see things as they deem good to you.
However... i had different impression from the quoted statement.

personaly, i wish all the good luck to mig-35 for indian MRCA race.

[amit27]

I hope Eurofighter wins mrca, its the 2nd best fighter to the f22 and will scare the living daylight out of the j10

[Luftwaffe]

amit27...did you introduce yourself in members intro section.
so explain why Malaysian Air Force is retiring its mig-29s.

[BATMAN]

I hope Eurofighter wins mrca, its the 2nd best fighter to the f22 and will scare the living daylight out of the j10

Are you sure?

Some times we hear it is LCA and lately we start to hear that PAk-FA is an equivalent to F-22!
Please... don't confuse us more.

Why ignore Chinese 5th generation a/c, after all you are not going to fly F-16 or Euro Fighter any time in near future!

BTW... J10 are expecting to receive MLU.... why do you wan't to compare a decade old plane? (it will be in 2015.)

[amit27]

amit27...did you introduce yourself in members intro section.
so explain why Malaysian Air Force is retiring its mig-29s.

Im Sorry i didn't intro myself im amit a guju from london

Well as i understand it is that mig29 and f16 is last gen technology from the cold war 70's era. U may well know that many European nations are replacing the f16 but that doesen't mean the f16 is bad does it? its just a cycle of buy and replace i thought.

[amit27]

Are you sure?

Some times we hear it is LCA and lately we start to hear that PAk-FA is an equivalent to F-22!

Please... don't confuse us more.

Why ignore Chinese 5th generation a/c, after all you are not going to fly F-16 or Euro Fighter any time in near future!

Even Putin hasen't said the Pak-Fa is equal to F22 yet. The Pak-fa has some 5th gen technology but it has a long way to go in avionics and producing new 5th gen engines to really be considered in the same league as the f-22.

As for the LCA well the clue is in the name (light combat aircraft) which is single engine and a replacement for the mig21's.

[Guynextdoor]

Actually, trying to capture a market with a 'low cost' strategy isn't all that much of a great idea. Low cost also means low recovery value. In a strategic area like defence where the cost of R&D is very high it's not a great thing, means financial weakness when you look at ambitious projects. The point is are you gud enuf to supply to the AFs that count? Afs that need a strong technical product? AF's that can shell out the cash? IAF will conisder the russians along with the americans and the europeans but not the chinese...not for a long time.

And here I'm talking about the impact of russians losing out to lower priced business segments.

[Luftwaffe]

strangly 2 indian guys are dragging chinese and their "planes" in this thread for some unknown reason maybe on retard therapy.

[amit27]

strangly 2 indian guys are dragging chinese and their "planes" in this thread for some unknown reason maybe on retard therapy.

I hope u dont mean me as i already said JF17 thunder is a fine plane for low income nations such as in africa. My original point is that Russia banned the sales due to protectionism it has sour taste when China copied the su27 and now China is trying to muscle into exporting market this is pure and simple business nothing more nothing less!

[Guynextdoor]

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Are you sure?

Some times we hear it is LCA and lately we start to hear that PAk-FA is an equivalent to F-22!
Please... don't confuse us more.

Why ignore Chinese 5th generation a/c, after all you are not going to fly F-16 or Euro Fighter any time in near future!

BTW... J10 are expecting to receive MLU.... why do you wan't to compare a decade old plane? (it will be in 2015.)

a. There's no data to show that Pak Fa won't be equal to F 22
b. Y would we be bothered about a chinese 5th gen when nothing is known about it or it hasn't even flown yet so factor it as a comparison with eurofighter
c. Since the chinese AF has made no confirmation that they'll induct JF 17, I' m guessing u mean of a conflict scenario where Pak AF will be flying those. There's no confirmation there either. Besides if it ever flies in Pak AF, it'll be way way after & beyond India inducts EF. J 10 will be no competition to MMRCA contenders even if it is inducted some 5 yrs later.