Feedback

[WebMaster]

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I need feedback from members, and want to hear what they think about Pakistani Forces Forum and how it runs. If you have any problem with it, dont agree with some of the things. Please let us know, we will try to fix that issue and make your stay comfortable.

Now feel free to say it. You have freedom of speech with respect!

[KashifAsrar]

I have few observations and want to share.

1. The link to access the last post in a thread is not working properly and says some thing like 'No Thread specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator'. Please check it and restore the script !

2. The new additions to the forums are excellent. Sincere congratulations !! Good job !! Particularly the 'Research Center'

3. 'Islam and Islamic History' was long due !! Thanks again to introduce it !! We must not miss the point that we are MUSLIMS first and then any thing else !!

Over all a good job, well done !!
Kashif

[WebMaster]

I didn't quite get it. The link to access the last post in a thread? What link? Where is it located at? Any screen shot?

It will help me quite well to understand the problem.

Thank you.

[Officer of Engineers]

The life of a thread is an issue. Threads are trashed way too early without the benefit of long term data collection and knowledge build up. I find that I'm repeating the same arguements that I've already made in a previous thread that now resides in the trashcan.

[KashifAsrar]

I didn't quite get it. The link to access the last post in a thread? What link? Where is it located at? Any screen shot?

It will help me quite well to understand the problem.

Thank you.

i hope the attached image help in the matter!!
One more thing is that I am not getting any 'Nationality Flag' in the posts. I mean even my nationality is not displayed under my name when I post a topic. What may be the case?
Kashif

[Tiki Tam Tam]

PFF is a nice departure from other Pakistan centric sites.

The balanced approach in handling the issues is very commendable.

The only request is that religion should not be cranked into every mundane issue.

I am sure religion is sacrosant. Therefore, it should not be bandied about in a loose way or worn on the sleeve as if it is an exotic elixir!

[Tiki Tam Tam]

'Islam and Islamic History' was long due !! Thanks again to introduce it !! We must not miss the point that we are MUSLIMS first and then any thing else !!

Further, I disagree with this contention of Kasif's of remembering foremost "that we are MUSLIMS first and then anything else."

How does that effect the flow of discussion so long it is sensible and respectful to all religions?

If being Moslem is the sole credential for discussion and the sole benchmark of correctness, then there is no scope for any discussion even on the mundane, because a person will invoke religion and then it will mean the "end of discussion"!

Tolerance and not religious oneupmanship should be the answer.

So far, the PFF has not subscribed to this ideology and that is why it is attracting many who are not of the Faith.

A forum can grow only if it allows a "thousand flowers to bloom" and not merely believe that "Power grow through the barrel of Religion".

Let PFF flourish and become a midway platform for all to have a fair and healthy exchange of views and bring closer in thought people of various nations.

I concede that there has to be discipline, but discipline is not enforcing religion on those not of the Faith or using religion as the last word!

In fact, such statements as Kasif's do encourage insecurity in others and therefore, even if a Mod moderates rightly, there always lurks the feeling of having being religious profiled!

This type of irrational sentiment is what is isolating Islam and then Muslims wonder why are they being isolated.

Such statements actually are "threatening and scary". Such statements make wonder if Intolerance is the bottomline. Obviously, if that is so, then naturally no one not of the Faith will feel comfortable or embrace the idea that they are second class and can be removed from the scene because of religious oneupmanship. As Islam detest the current actions as claims that there is a War on Islam, then Kasif's type of views also threatens others that Islam is waging war on others by not considering them as equal human beings.

But then this your forum and you are the best judge.

[Spring Onion]

Sir i think u had misunderstood kashif, what i understand is that he was praising the inclusion of section on Islamic History which was not there b4 and as Muslims we do take care of our religion in almost all aspects of our lives so he was saying that being a site run by Muslims the inclusion of section on Islam was over due.

Now Sir it doesnt mean that people from other faiths are barred from posting on the forum, And i dont think so PFF has ever done that theres freedom of exchanging views without any discrimination of religion of faith.
We dont ask other members to believe what we believe in.

Good Work Webby

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Sir i think u had misunderstood kashif, what i understand is that he was praising the inclusion of section on Islamic History which was not there b4 and as Muslims we do take care of our religion in almost all aspects of our lives so he was saying that being a site run by Muslims the inclusion of section on Islam was over due.

Now Sir it doesnt mean that people from other faiths are barred from posting on the forum, And i dont think so PFF has ever done that theres freedom of exchanging views without any discrimination of religion of faith.
We dont ask other members to believe what we believe in.

Good Work Webby

Jana,

How does it make any difference if you are a Muslim first or not when you are posting on the Islamic Faith sub forum, even if that is what Kashif meant?!

How are you so sure that a Muslim alone understands Islamic tenets and its interpretation?

There was this person who claimed to be some expert on Islam being a Musim and he debunked Shahi Bukhari!

Now, if a non Muslim read it, he would believe that Shahi Bukhari is not correct and that it has no part to play in Islam!

Would that be correct?

So, it is no guarantee that "being Muslim first before anything else" is any certificate that that person actually knows the tenets of Islam, let alone understand it.

Check the stuff on Jihad.

I could quote from the Koran and what is written on Jihad in the thread is incomplete and is just being politically correct.

However, I will not go into any debate on Islam, be it a sub forum or not, because I have no desire to "educate" anyone since each to his own and if it brings consolation to one, why go and ruin one's happiness?


Therefore, your defence of Kashif is similar to the Australians defence of Hair!

I know you will once again dub this as my hypocrisy and double standards, but then I will accept the same with good grace since I am here to learn and not upset people or prove that I know more than them or I am a better person than them!

I am but what I am with all the foibles of a human being.

[KashifAsrar]

Salim Sahab
When you say,

Further, I disagree with this contention of Kasif's of remembering foremost "that we are MUSLIMS first and then anything else."
How does that effect the flow of discussion so long it is sensible and respectful to all religions?

Can you tell the esteemed readers and participants of this forum, HOW being a MUSLIM debars one from having a 'Sensible and respectful discussion', as you fear it would?

Tolerance and not religious oneupmanship should be the answer.

How being MUSLIM is against being TOLERANT ?
And I would like to correct you when you say that :

.. not merely believe that "Power grow through the barrel of Religion".

we Muslims belive in that: POWER FLOW THROUGH THE BARREL OF RELIGION, NOT VISE-VERSA!!

In fact, such statements as Kasif's do encourage insecurity in others and therefore, even if a Mod moderates rightly, there always lurks the feeling of having being religious profiled!

These kind of statements just display a sort of inferiority complex in you SIR. Nothing more !!
And I am right when you say

Such statements actually are "threatening and scary".

And from this inferiority bred fear you wrongly concludes

Such statements make wonder if Intolerance is the bottomline.

Further SIR when you say

There was this person who claimed to be some expert on Islam being a Musim and he debunked Shahi Bukhari!

mere CLAIM do not make person an Islamic Scholar. Had that been the case, then we would have found, that all Neo-cons, Zionists and Evengelics are Islamic Experts !!
You say that

I could quote from the Koran and what is written on Jihad in the thread is incomplete and is just being politically correct.

for your kind information the Hindu religious books such as GEETA is a philosphy exclusively orchestrated by Krishna to Arjun to go for WAR in the name of DHARAM !! It would not be that wise SIR to point to the mirror where YOU can also see your face along with MUSLIMS !!!

Kindly give some cool thoughts to what JANA said. ISLAM is a way of life NOT a way OUT of life, as west is preaching now-a-days !!
Thanks and regards
Kashif

[Tiki Tam Tam]

[QUOTE]

Salim Sahab
When you say,

Can you tell the esteemed readers and participants of this forum, HOW being a MUSLIM debars one from having a 'Sensible and respectful discussion', as you fear it would?

Obviously, it would not debar anyone from having a sensible and respectable discussion.

My contention is how does being a Muslim makes him any better than someone else on a forum discussion? What so special about Muslims on a forum that is so exclusively enlightening that is a void in others?

How being MUSLIM is against being TOLERANT ?
And I would like to correct you when you say that :
we Muslims belive in that: POWER FLOW THROUGH THE BARREL OF RELIGION, NOT VISE-VERSA!!

Let power be where it is and let it not worry us in a forum. Let it not flow or grow from any barrel of any religion while we are on a forum. And religion is supposed to bring peace to all and an instrument of peace and not an instrument of power and resultant strife. Power has an aggressive connotation.

These kind of statements just display a sort of inferiority complex in you SIR. Nothing more !!
And I am right when you say

It does not show any inferiority. One doesn't have to wear this religion on his sleeve. The issue of "scary and threatened implies" that it is revolts (scares) the mind as if one is itching for a fight (threatened).

mere CLAIM do not make person an Islamic Scholar. Had that been the case, then we would have found, that all Neo-cons, Zionists and Evengelics are Islamic Experts !!
You say that

A good defence of that gentleman I would say. But his coc-kiness to debunk Bukhari was as if he was the last word in Islamic scholar and Bukhari was bogus. He was wearing it on his sleeve as you did by gleefully announcing that none should forget that one is a Muslim and then something else. In short, if one is not an scholar, then one should have the humility to not assume the mantle nor act coc-ky.

for your kind information the Hindu religious books such as GEETA is a philosphy exclusively orchestrated by Krishna to Arjun to go for WAR in the name of DHARAM !! It would not be that wise SIR to point to the mirror where YOU can also see your face along with MUSLIMS !!!

Let the Hindu books say anything. It does not worry me nor concerns me the least. In fact, I know less of Hinduism than Islam, not that it matters to anyone. In case you are not aware I am no use for religion since it has brought no peace to this world and instead has only lead to strife while at the same time spewing pious platitudes. I am pragmatic and so I have no time for all these extra burden to shoulder.

Kindly give some cool thoughts to what JANA said. ISLAM is a way of life NOT a way OUT of life, as west is preaching now-a-days !!
Thanks and regards
Kashif[

That is very true. Every religion claims it is a way of life and proves to be a way OUT of life (to quote your clever words). Just like war is not about being right, it is about what is left!

Let me assure you that no religion impresses me since all it has given mankind is strife and that is about all; while at the same time, pretending to be of peace. Think that out coolly

Now think also about the way I believe - live and let live and enjoy the bountiful nature that is a supernatural phenomenon of origin of which no one knows how it came about.

Religion was created to be a means to being societal order to barbarians and that is about all. It has achieved to some extent but it doing so, it has skewed up the world also. To me it has outlived its value.

You are a human being and so am I and so is most of us. Was there any difference in our physical, psychological or mental being when we were born? No. But thereafter religion has divided mankind and over very ridiculous and paltry issues. Is that a way of life? If that be so, you keep it but let me be devoid of religion. Life is my religion. I do not prefer to be bounded in shackles by something that only brings strife to mankind and pretends to bringing peace!

May your God go with you.

Thank you.

[sigatoka]

[quote=Salim;24863]

Let me assure you that no religion impresses me since all it has given mankind is strife and that is about all; while at the same time, pretending to be of peace. Think that out coolly

But thereafter religion has divided mankind and over very ridiculous and paltry issues. Is that a way of life? If that be so, you keep it but let me be devoid of religion. Life is my religion. I do not prefer to be bounded in shackles by something that only brings strife to mankind and pretends to bringing peace!

Thats a bit harsh, a lot of conflicts would occur even if there was no religion around. Conflicts will exist as long as one party believes it can gain more from fighting than not fighting even overall loss occurs(and such situations will always be present).

In reality a lot of conflicts that would exist anyway are given religious reasons to motivate fighters of one side. Indeed in the world right now Jihadists do use religion to a far greater extent to motivate, recruit and fight than other entities (like standing armies). But why is it better to motivate men to kill others with the use of money (as soldiers get) and not religion? Why is it more justified to use Patriotism to get Indians to volunteer to fight, die and kill in Kashmir rather than Religion as used by their opponents? If one has decided to fight, then one most fight using whatever tools at his disposal to achieve the desired outcome (victory). A lot of entities use salaries, patriotism or the promise of loot, others motivate with religion.

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Because you can"feel" and "see" a country. It is an entity.

Religion is abstract.

Has anyone seen God?

I am sure people of Pakistan has seen Pakistan.

Since you allude to Kashmir, you will understand the feeling because you have Balochistan and Gilgit to make you experience the same feeling. Therefore, I don't have to explain that aspect. Visit the Bugti thread and you have your answer! Religion in both the cases is immaterial to the fact!

[A.Rahman]

Check the stuff on Jihad.

I could quote from the Koran and what is written on Jihad in the thread is incomplete and is just being politically correct.

What I posted is from Scholar, not the work of some Neocon or OBL.

please do quote quran (in seperate thread ofcourse), will be an interesting read.

[Tiki Tam Tam]

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As I stated, I will not indulge in religious stuff.

Asim will bear me out that it turns nasty and infructuous, apart from creating bad blood.

He can also tell you what has been stated.

I aim to have a peaceful and comfortable stay out here as far as feasible since I am enjoying the environment to a great degree with the present state of affairs.