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Questions About Exploitation of Indian "IT Coolies"

stupid logic. the main property of IT in india is the people. So in case of was only uildings will be destroyed and maybe computers (which i am sure are insured) the data server will reside in client location in us or europe. No critical data is needed. Also bangalore may have been the first but there are IT centres in whole of india and all major it companies have centres in all cities of india. So eg if bangalore is bombed and a few campuses of infy are destroyed, trust me infy centres in other locations will still deliver. I know for a fact that disaster recovery is always planned. In time of war , yes business will slow down but, will recover.
How will indian bombing of pakistan impact its economy?:bounce:

Stupid response.

In a nuclear war between India and Pakistan 200+ Nukes will be traded. If you think buildings will be the only casualties then we can end the discussion here.
 
Tech.. What you are saying and what Riaz is are 2 totally different angles. Are you really missing the intent of his article or are you feeling compelled to side with it becuase he is also a Pakistani? Criticism doesnt deserve a counter attack but an offensive comment like Riaz's doesnt deserve anything else.

I expect a more nuanced understanding from you, Karan. Do you see me making a blanket case for Riaz here, or are you simply perturbed that I happen to hold the innovation-is-lacking-in-the-indian-IT-industry view I shared above? As I said previously, obviously my indian friends are getting defensive... I shared the NYT piece and the quote with you... if you don't want to consider my opinion, perhaps you would consider that of your own SW industry's stalwarts? Alternatively, you are welcome to ignore both.

Good day.
 
Stupid response.

In a nuclear war between India and Pakistan 200+ Nukes will be traded. If you think buildings will be the only casualties then we can end the discussion here.

Lets limit discussions to India's software professionals or so called coolies.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/02/world/asia/02iht-letter.html?scp=3&sq=india&st=nyt


The Promise of India's Nascent Economy


By AKASH KAPUR
Published: July 1, 2010


KOOT ROAD, INDIA — This is the kind of dusty crossing that might once have been referred to as a farming town.

A couple of decades ago, it was surrounded by fields of rice and sugarcane. Agriculture was the lifeblood of the economy. Farmers clogged the streets with ox carts and gunnysacks, hawking their crops in makeshift stalls.

The stalls are still there, spilling over onto the roads and holding up traffic. It’s possible to see an occasional ox cart lumbering between flashy new cars and motorcycles. But over the years, agriculture has become less important to this town in the southern state of Tamil Nadu. Many of the fields have been sold, turned into housing projects or other real estate developments. Young people no longer become farmers; they move to the cities, in search of new opportunities.

Since the 1990s, when India shed its socialist past and began introducing market reforms, the structure of its economy has changed dramatically. Agriculture, which in 1990 accounted for about 30 percent of gross domestic product, now accounts for only 17.5 percent. Industry has declined from more than a quarter of G.D.P. to a just a fifth.

The most striking change has been the growing importance of services, a broad category that includes banking, communications and real estate. From 1990 to 2009, the share of services in India’s economy grew from 44.7 percent to 62.6 percent.

Many factors are at play in this transformation. One of the most important is the rise of what India calls its ITES (or information technology enabled services) industry. Over the last two decades or so, this industry has been one of the fastest growing in the country.

The impact of this rapid growth was first apparent in the cities — in the shiny technology parks and office complexes that housed the new software companies, and in a sense of optimism and self-confidence that was born from the success of those companies.

More recently, that optimism has been trickling down to the countryside. In towns like this and in the surrounding villages, the old agricultural economy is dying.

But the promise of a new economy beckons. For the young, in particular, technology offers the prospect of both personal and national salvation.

On a recent morning, I visited a computer training center here. It was run by a couple in their 20s. They were small-town entrepreneurs; they owned a couple of cellphone stores.

In a freshly painted room, about 20 young men and women sat in front of flat-screen monitors.

Two boys and a girl struggled with an HTML file. They had recently graduated from the equivalent of high school, and they were looking to the future. They told me of their ambitions to study engineering, to make money, to start their own businesses.

All of these goals, they said, depended on one thing: computer literacy. That’s why they were sitting in that room on a hot vacation morning, paying anywhere from 1,500 to 5,000 rupees, or up to $107, for their lessons.

The students spoke excitedly about the fortunes to be made in technology. They talked about Bill Gates, and about Infosys, HCL and Tata Consultancy Services, three of India’s most successful companies. It was clear that they saw technology as a path to riches.

But while their interest in computers was driven in part by personal ambition, I was struck, too, by the sense of collective purpose, even nationalism, they seemed to attach to the lessons they were taking.

K. Selvakannan, a skinny boy with a pen clipped to his shirt pocket, said that in another era, he might have been a freedom fighter. Now, he said, a technical education was “the new patriotism.”

“In my village, I am one of the few who knows computers. We have to learn for the country,” he said, adding that he planned to return to his village to create jobs and prosperity.

This entanglement of personal ambition and national purpose is in many ways typical of India’s relationship to its technology industry. Ever since the ITES sector emerged to prominence in the late 1990s, it has come to represent a vehicle for both individual and collective aspirations.

A generation has grown up seduced by promises of stock options and venture capital. The same generation has been inspired, too, by visions of “leapfrog development” and India as a “knowledge society.”

In truth, the relationship between the ITES sector and India’s broader economy remains somewhat unclear.

For all its contributions to G.D.P., the technology industry is directly responsible for less than two million jobs, a pittance in a nation where the labor force numbers almost half a billion. Some economists worry about the specter of “jobless growth”— the prospect that India’s development will be led by skill-intensive services while labor-intensive industry and manufacturing lag.

Such worries continue to dog an otherwise ebullient sector of the economy.

But in places like this, where a new generation is leaving behind the professions (and the poverty) of their parents, there is little sign of such anxiety. At the computer training center, I sensed only a deep faith in the future, an almost serene confidence that the technology-led boom experienced by urban India is finally spreading.

Before leaving, I spoke to M. Aparna, who had started the training center with her husband. She was optimistic about the future. She said the number of students kept growing. Even the older generation was coming into the center now, with farmers now trying to learn how to use computers.

Outside the center, under the cellphone store Ms. Aparna owned with her husband, a tractor was parked by the side of the road. The owner, a shirtless farmer, was barefoot. His feet were caked with red earth.

Once, I thought, this would have been his town. Now he just looked out of place.
 
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Just yesterday, Ratan Tata of TCS said the focus now "would be to climb the value chain in a bid to differentiate its services from competition."

It's obvious from the statement that Tata knows it. TCS is all low-value coolie work done in its sweatshops....its only differentiation is the lowest possible cost, nothing else.

yes, the client companies are paying top $$ (in relative terms) so that they get low cost work at poor quality as implied in your stmt.
indian IT is getting from strength to strength for the last 20 years and there is and there will always be an element of repetitive work in it. and india is best positioned to pluck that low hanging fruit.
 
I expect a more nuanced understanding from you, Karan. Do you see me making a blanket case for Riaz here, or are you simply perturbed that I happen to hold the innovation-is-lacking-in-the-indian-IT-industry view I shared above? As I said previously, obviously my indian friends are getting defensive... I shared the NYT piece and the quote with you... if you don't want to consider my opinion, perhaps you would consider that of your own SW industry's stalwarts? Alternatively, you are welcome to ignore both.

Good day.

Tech.. I have no issues with your comments or view about Indian IT industry since thats what I call constructive criticism which creates opportunities to improve. And we have had a whole thread on this some weeks back. Riaz on the other hand mostly (always) has an agenda to malign , or so it seems. Hence the response to him as such..
 
I expect a more nuanced understanding from you, Karan. Do you see me making a blanket case for Riaz here, or are you simply perturbed that I happen to hold the innovation-is-lacking-in-the-indian-IT-industry view I shared above? As I said previously, obviously my indian friends are getting defensive... I shared the NYT piece and the quote with you... if you don't want to consider my opinion, perhaps you would consider that of your own SW industry's stalwarts? Alternatively, you are welcome to ignore both.

Good day.

[Mod edit for language]

reason, why do you consider only the fantastic work of google, apple and ms to be innovation.
Innovation is improving existing processes. Is it not process-innovation on the part of indian it in the process of low cost execution of software on a scalable and consistent platform? I think this innovation in process has saved US companies tonnes of money, made indian it tonnes of money and created jobs both in india and us.
lastly , if you are abusing or not impresed with indian IT, then i am sure i can assume that you hold the same feeling for china and its manufacturing.
 
^^ Good for you. Write a letter to Mr. Raghavan of Infosys who blasted innovation in India's SW industry in his interview to the NYT. Take it up with him.
 
oh pakistanis please save us. i am an indian coolie in the it industry.
everyday i am made to get up early in the morning and get out of the house by 730am because i have a job, the bus ride takes 2 hours. once we get to the coolie-zone, we are asked to do low end work. We get paid only 5-30 lakhs INR for starter to sr project managers, but are asked to meet deadlines. we are even asked to write good quality code, other wise there are wicked team leads waiting to give us a bad rating in the appraisal and not give us a chance to visit the client locations in exotic places of the world. But dont worry, I try my best togive poor code, but those foolish cleints in the US, europe are so dumb that they take whatever we give in return for our $$. the coolie zone offices in india, are hell holes to work. the building is fully airconditioned causing global warming, they have all kinds of tea and snacks in the pantry and the food courts have only 1 pizzeria thats all . truly hell. i dont even have time to go to the temple and pray.
anyways i need to tolerate all this because i just bought a house for about 90 L and need to pay an emi of about 70000 per month. and of course i just also bought the new mahindra scorpio for my family for which also i have to pay thru my nose. Also my kids are getting an education in the best primary schools and they also steal a lot of money. what can i do? Please can you destroy all this because we are suffering so much.
 
3534595667_d87ef556d3_b.jpg


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Hey that is Techno park, worlds greenest IT park, in my city. With the coming of this one , the land scape has been transformed and infrastructure sector and banking is booming with most of them related to IT people working there.

Thanks for the upload.
 
oh pakistanis please save us. i am an indian coolie in the it industry.
everyday i am made to get up early in the morning and get out of the house by 730am because i have a job, the bus ride takes 2 hours. once we get to the coolie-zone, we are asked to do low end work.

I'm very happy for you and I hope you prosper further.

I will, however, tell you though that the story you narrate above is not the story of the 2-3M people involved in the IT industry in India. The bulk of these people are not paid wages like you. I don't like the "coolie" label and haven't used that word at all. It is demeaning to coolies - who work hard - and to IT workers. But if you've encountered personal success and have been able to buy a house and car, I don't think you should toot your horn about that especially because you are not talking about the vast majority of IT workers. The bulk of these folks work in call centers, or other indirect enablement positions and I guarantee you they don't own a 90lac home.

Anyway, I see you've decided to adopt a very sarcastic tone rather than attempting to discuss issues on their merit. If that's the road you want to go down, that's fine with me.
 
^^ Good for you. Write a letter to Mr. Raghavan of Infosys who blasted innovation in India's SW industry in his interview to the NYT. Take it up with him.

Thank you pointing it out...my post also contains multiple quotes from thoughtful Indian columnists, commentators and industry people. There are quotes in it from Praful Bidwai, Harish Trivedi, an Indian blogger and an Indian IT worker...all expressing concern about the way the Indian IT industry treats its people.

After all, "cyber coolie" was invented by an Indian, not me.

I can understand the concerns of Bidwai, Trivedi, et al about Indian IT workers, given the Bhopal tragedy and its aftermath that shows how little Indian democracy cares for its people.
 
Here's a pre-view of the upcoming NBS serial "Outsourced" :

 
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