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A practical look at the Kashmir issue

IbnAbdullah

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Salaam


So the Indians have revoked the article that gave special rights to J&K territory. The Indians seem to be celebrating like they've just conquered Azad Kashmir and some Pakistanis are reacting like Azad Kashmir has been conquered by India.

The reality is that not one inch of the LOC has moved. These articles weren't going to ensure that Kashmir was about to be liberated - they didn't for the last 70 years and they weren't likely going to for the next 70 as well.

What these articles actually did was the opposite of helping the Kashmir cause. They helped pacify the local population by giving them special rights - rather the illusion of special rights. As today Mahbooba Mufti has said that India has become an occupational force today. Today.

People are upset that it will help the Indians in changing the demographics of Kashmir. Like somehow we were ever going to win Kashmir through an election. India hadn't been winning by a small margin in the Kashmir elections from us and thus had been able to rule it - it was always a military occupation.

It would have to be won the same way that Azad Kashmir was won. That has not changed.

---

However, that does not mean nothing has changed. The Kashmir territory was internationally recognised by - UN resolutions and all - to be a disputed territory. It still is. However, the Indian resolution doesn't change that one bit.

This will, however, legitimise the Kashmiri struggle to some degree.

More importantly - Nay, most importantly - it will help the separatist movement in Kashmir.

Pakistan supported both the Afghan movement and the Kashmiri movement - one managed to beat two superpowers whilst the other wasn't as successful. Reason was simple - and an open secret - the Kashmiris weren't really doing much 'struggling' in the Kashmir struggle.

The Kashmiris were comfortable - and they were satisfied. The struggled almost died out in the last decades.

Then came Modi and co- and their actions helped push minorities aside and you ended up with Burhan Wani. And now they have done this - and you even have GOI allies like Mahbooba Mufti saying Kashmir is under Indian occupation.

Now the Kashmiris will find themselves pushed into a hard corner with no illusions of 'special treatment' and being threatened with demographic change.

Now the newer generation will finally feel they are being invaded by Hindus (when the cow rakhshaks come). Then you will find that the movement for freedom will stand on its own feet.

Once the Kashmir struggle stands on its own feet - with a little help, the results will be much better this time around.

---

Another interesting point, is that they have divided it into three separate territories. I don't think that is anything that goes against Pakistan's interests. It implies an understanding by the GOI that is much better for Pakistan than what we currently have. Pakistan stands to gain not lose.

Add to this Trump's comment about modi asking for mediation. The Kashmir issue may be closer to a peaceful resolution with this than before.

But that is for another day.

---
Summary

The Indians have not conquered an inch more of Azad Kashmir. They weren't about to hold the plebiscite anytime soon so this move isn't going to, in reality, hurt Pakistani interest in Kashmir.

It will only help the Kashmir movement by removing the illusion of special rights.

This move has brought back the Kashmir movement from the brink. It will likely be much more effective because it will be local.

The division of Kashmir into three - especially the separating of the Muslim part - implies the Indians too fear something and wish to minimise the loss.

The Indians have essentially removed the legal cover from their control over Occupied Kashmir.

The kashmir issue may have moved closer to a solution agreed by both Pakistan and India because of this.


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its too funny to see peolpe enjoying or angry . only thing india did it forced even modrate kashmiris to think against india . there was no fight in LEH alreay it was same as GB of pakistan . we already did it what india did today .BTW velly will remain same fight will be always as it is and issue will remain same .
 
If I could, I would give this a positive rating.
I think this nails it. Good thread. LOC hasn't moved an inch. And what India has done only will bring moderate and liberal Kashmiri people to realization of reality.

In International Law, no matter what India does, it will remain disputed territory, and that's an important basis for us.
 
its too funny to see peolpe enjoying or angry . only thing india did it forced even modrate kashmiris to think against india . there was no fight in LEH alreay it was same as GB of pakistan . we already did it what india did today .BTW velly will remain same fight will be always as it is and issue will remain same .

No offense you are still living in the fools paradise lol open your eyes or more Kashmir are going to get martyred. Now India intention are clear it is going to apply Israel-palestine model on the Kashmir.
 
No offense you are still living in the fools paradise lol open your eyes or more Kashmir are going to get martyred. Now India intention are clear it is going to apply Israel-palestine model on the Kashmir.
nope it will not just watch it with realistic eye sir .
 
Salaam


So the Indians have revoked the article that gave special rights to J&K territory. The Indians seem to be celebrating like they've just conquered Azad Kashmir and some Pakistanis are reacting like Azad Kashmir has been conquered by India.

The reality is that not one inch of the LOC has moved. These articles weren't going to ensure that Kashmir was about to be liberated - they didn't for the last 70 years and they weren't likely going to for the next 70 as well.

What these articles actually did was the opposite of helping the Kashmir cause. They helped pacify the local population by giving them special rights - rather the illusion of special rights. As today Mahbooba Mufti has said that India has become an occupational force today. Today.

People are upset that it will help the Indians in changing the demographics of Kashmir. Like somehow we were ever going to win Kashmir through an election. India hadn't been winning by a small margin in the Kashmir elections from us and thus had been able to rule it - it was always a military occupation.

It would have to be won the same way that Azad Kashmir was won. That has not changed.

---

However, that does not mean nothing has changed. The Kashmir territory was internationally recognised by - UN resolutions and all - to be a disputed territory. It still is. However, the Indian resolution doesn't change that one bit.

This will, however, legitimise the Kashmiri struggle to some degree.

More importantly - Nay, most importantly - it will help the separatist movement in Kashmir.

Pakistan supported both the Afghan movement and the Kashmiri movement - one managed to beat two superpowers whilst the other wasn't as successful. Reason was simple - and an open secret - the Kashmiris weren't really doing much 'struggling' in the Kashmir struggle.

The Kashmiris were comfortable - and they were satisfied. The struggled almost died out in the last decades.

Then came Modi and co- and their actions helped push minorities aside and you ended up with Burhan Wani. And now they have done this - and you even have GOI allies like Mahbooba Mufti saying Kashmir is under Indian occupation.

Now the Kashmiris will find themselves pushed into a hard corner with no illusions of 'special treatment' and being threatened with demographic change.

Now the newer generation will finally feel they are being invaded by Hindus (when the cow rakhshaks come). Then you will find that the movement for freedom will stand on its own feet.

Once the Kashmir struggle stands on its own feet - with a little help, the results will be much better this time around.

---

Another interesting point, is that they have divided it into three separate territories. I don't think that is anything that goes against Pakistan's interests. It implies an understanding by the GOI that is much better for Pakistan than what we currently have. Pakistan stands to gain not lose.

Add to this Trump's comment about modi asking for mediation. The Kashmir issue may be closer to a peaceful resolution with this than before.

But that is for another day.

---
Summary

The Indians have not conquered an inch more of Azad Kashmir. They weren't about to hold the plebiscite anytime soon so this move isn't going to, in reality, hurt Pakistani interest in Kashmir.

It will only help the Kashmir movement by removing the illusion of special rights.

This move has brought back the Kashmir movement from the brink. It will likely be much more effective because it will be local.

The division of Kashmir into three - especially the separating of the Muslim part - implies the Indians too fear something and wish to minimise the loss.

The Indians have essentially removed the legal cover from their control over Occupied Kashmir.

The kashmir issue may have moved closer to a solution agreed by both Pakistan and India because of this.


....
You are very right .
Taking away the status of statehood from kashmiris that enjoy it for 72 years is going to go down really bad and even mainstream politicians would make a hue and a cry .
What they have achieved is bring it like Pakistan . Gb is a federal territory ruled its legislative assembly and center Controls it . Similarly fata was which is now merged and so is azad kashmir.
Don't know what they achieved there. Unless they go on full isreal and make walled settlements there . But there economy is going down, some saying the true growth rate is 2.5 percent and worst recession is on cards plus elections of 5 major states are coming .
This would help Pakistan to internationlise kashmir issue and now even talk to mainstream leaders that finally after 70 years they have been betrayed as we have been telling you .
We pakistanis have frankly lost too much for kashmir and kahsmiris have always betrayed us. That's reality . Who betrayed us in 1990s, kahsmiris do ....
So basically now they have to fight their own war if they want to or get their wives and fighters raped , killed by pallet guns or killed. Had we allow any proxies that would have destroyed the Indian army now . But the world sees we are abiding our promise . All we need is good diplomacy and media cells now

Need to arm and support the insurgents/rebels.
I hope IK have awoken from the sleep of pacifism. Must direct all energies to destabilize India.
Situation is quite tense right now . If they attack now it would be a complete limited war and it is huge responsibility to not go for that.
 
If we want Kashmir issue resolved without war then below is the only peaceful option..
India can keep Ladahk State but some parts will come to Pakistan so Sichan Glassier can be military free area .. And Jamu State(Valley) goes to Pakistan ………… That's it ……… If both country are ready to do it ..
If not we subcontinent people going to kill 1+ billion of each other in all-out war …… and that war is very near ……

@Nilgiri , @Imran Khan , @war&peace , @all other anti war …….
 
If we want Kashmir issue resolved without war then below is the only peaceful option..
India can keep Ladahk State but some parts will come to Pakistan so Sichan Glassier can be military free area .. And Jamu State(Valley) goes to Pakistan ………… That's it ……… If both country are ready to do it ..
If not we subcontinent people going to kill 1+ billion of each other in all-out war …… and that war is very near ……

@Nilgiri , @Imran Khan , @war&peace , @all other anti war …….
please read 5 solutions which were on table few months ago .
 
lol JnK getting UT status means, the dynasts netas even in power are nothing more than municipalty mayors. Not worth the risks you take. They already send their kids abroad have properties abroad just in case(ofc funnelled azadi money while kids in kashmiri going blind by pellet guns:cheesy:). No office or constitutional power, can be easily bullied or bought off. Meanwhile all state machinery, police will be under Delhi. Do you know what this means? how easily cases can be framed and all and prosecuted too. Guess will have to open some new fertilizer factories in kashmir like one opened in gorakhpur by Yogi Adityanath khikhikhi
 
There will never be peace between Pakistan and India. There can only be peace between;
  • Pakistan and the smaller states we carve out of India.
  • India and the smaller states they carve out of us.
Anyone who thinks otherwise is living in a fools paradise. We should plan for that.

The next step here are;
  • Arm and support the Kashmiri freedom fighters so they can strike back immediately.
  • Prepare irregular forces to flood into Kashmir once a localised conflict starts.
  • Provoke India into starting a localised conflict, then flood Kashmir with irregular forces.
  • Setup proxies across other Indian states/territories so as to stretch their security forces and put their population in fear. Lets see how they deal with 2 decades of regular bomb blasts.
  • Arrange a peace deal in Afghanistan urgently, tell USA the price is turning a blind eye to what happens in India.
 

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