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Bullet train would only reduce travel time for elites

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http://www.dailyo.in/variety/bullet-train-aviation-trains-high-speed-rail/story/1/19629.html

www.dailyo.in
Bullet train would only reduce travel time for elites

There has been a lot of debate on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad bullet train in the media. The debate has largely focused on whether, with so many competing priorities of upgradation, maintenance and above all safety, the railways should allocate resources to reduce a microscopic elite minority's travel time.

However, the question of high-speed rail goes beyond the problem of resource allocation, or for that matter, speed.

The biggest advantage of increased speeds is not the convenience to the traveller but an increase in capacity. More trains can be scheduled every day on the same track at higher speeds; a doubling in speed would mean a doubling in capacity. One might think that would mean bidding adieu to the great IRCTC tatkal lottery, but that's not the case. The ticket priced at several thousands of rupees is unaffordable for travellers sans the most affluent. We might end up with the existing congestion plus a very expensive, massively underutilised loss making capacity.

Another advantage of high-speed rail might be cutting down on carbon emissions by shifting passenger traffic from air and road to the new network. However, what inevitably happens with any new transport capacity creation, particularly in a fast-growing country like India, is seldom transformative, ie, it doesn't shift traffic from one mode to another. It rather has an additive impact which means it results in an increase of traffic for all modes of travel.

bullettrain690_092117025411.jpg
High-speed rail has been controversial all over the world, including in Britain and the United States.

The bullet train service might well have a capacity of several times the commercial aviation capacity between the two cities and perhaps even the existing conventional rail capacity. From a carbon emissions point of view, it might make sense to double the conventional track capacity than to introduce a bullet train service, as conventional rail services are more carbon efficient than high-speed rail.

If at all there will be a carbon benefit from high-speed rail, it will only come from drastic measures such as simultaneously ceasing all commercial aviation between the two cities and banning all private cars from the faster expressways.

Another much touted benefit is the impetus it will give to the economic life of small towns by connecting them to the metropolis. However, experience has often shown that megacities such as London (and perhaps Mumbai), are actually very good at centralisation and suck businesses out of vibrant small towns leaving behind commuter towns and countryside opened up for extended urban sprawl.

High-speed rail has been controversial all over the world, including in Britain and the United States; they are far from successful even in that land of milk and honey that is China. While environmental issues may not prove to be as much of a hurdle in India as they often do in the rich world, we still need to think very carefully about bullet trains. We may assume that this is merely a one-off costly experiment but such projects are usually part of an overall new vision of transport planning.

We may be experimenting with an inappropriate system, just as we have been with tiny Metro lines in tinier cities where other transport solutions may be more appropriate.

Also read: Maneka Gandhi is mistaken, food packets replacing mid-day meals won't ensure nutrition
 
http://www.dailyo.in/variety/bullet-train-aviation-trains-high-speed-rail/story/1/19629.html

www.dailyo.in
Bullet train would only reduce travel time for elites

There has been a lot of debate on the Mumbai-Ahmedabad bullet train in the media. The debate has largely focused on whether, with so many competing priorities of upgradation, maintenance and above all safety, the railways should allocate resources to reduce a microscopic elite minority's travel time.

However, the question of high-speed rail goes beyond the problem of resource allocation, or for that matter, speed.

The biggest advantage of increased speeds is not the convenience to the traveller but an increase in capacity. More trains can be scheduled every day on the same track at higher speeds; a doubling in speed would mean a doubling in capacity. One might think that would mean bidding adieu to the great IRCTC tatkal lottery, but that's not the case. The ticket priced at several thousands of rupees is unaffordable for travellers sans the most affluent. We might end up with the existing congestion plus a very expensive, massively underutilised loss making capacity.

Another advantage of high-speed rail might be cutting down on carbon emissions by shifting passenger traffic from air and road to the new network. However, what inevitably happens with any new transport capacity creation, particularly in a fast-growing country like India, is seldom transformative, ie, it doesn't shift traffic from one mode to another. It rather has an additive impact which means it results in an increase of traffic for all modes of travel.

bullettrain690_092117025411.jpg
High-speed rail has been controversial all over the world, including in Britain and the United States.

The bullet train service might well have a capacity of several times the commercial aviation capacity between the two cities and perhaps even the existing conventional rail capacity. From a carbon emissions point of view, it might make sense to double the conventional track capacity than to introduce a bullet train service, as conventional rail services are more carbon efficient than high-speed rail.

If at all there will be a carbon benefit from high-speed rail, it will only come from drastic measures such as simultaneously ceasing all commercial aviation between the two cities and banning all private cars from the faster expressways.

Another much touted benefit is the impetus it will give to the economic life of small towns by connecting them to the metropolis. However, experience has often shown that megacities such as London (and perhaps Mumbai), are actually very good at centralisation and suck businesses out of vibrant small towns leaving behind commuter towns and countryside opened up for extended urban sprawl.

High-speed rail has been controversial all over the world, including in Britain and the United States; they are far from successful even in that land of milk and honey that is China. While environmental issues may not prove to be as much of a hurdle in India as they often do in the rich world, we still need to think very carefully about bullet trains. We may assume that this is merely a one-off costly experiment but such projects are usually part of an overall new vision of transport planning.

We may be experimenting with an inappropriate system, just as we have been with tiny Metro lines in tinier cities where other transport solutions may be more appropriate.

Also read: Maneka Gandhi is mistaken, food packets replacing mid-day meals won't ensure nutrition
Same was said about air travel......


Fact is India is a nation of >1.3 billion people with the fastest growing middle class on the planet. In the near future there will be hundreds of millions of people in this bracket and their needs need to be taken care of too, not just the bottom 10%. Thus a wide range of transport solutions are to be available to all citizens.
 
The price of the Beijing-Shanghai high-speed rail 2nd class seat is about $6.4 per hundred kilometers and there are 44 couple of trains between the two cities every day, about 400000 passengers per day.China's high-speed rail fares are the cheapest in the world.But there are still a lot of people who can't afford the price.Your high-speed rail fare should not be cheaper than this.
 
Same was said about air travel......


Fact is India is a nation of >1.3 billion people with the fastest growing middle class on the planet. In the near future there will be hundreds of millions of people in this bracket and their needs need to be taken care of too, not just the bottom 10%. Thus a wide range of transport solutions are to be available to all citizens.

How do you define middle class? And what precisely is its growth rate? And what are your sources?
 
Same was said about air travel......


Fact is India is a nation of >1.3 billion people with the fastest growing middle class on the planet. In the near future there will be hundreds of millions of people in this bracket and their needs need to be taken care of too, not just the bottom 10%. Thus a wide range of transport solutions are to be available to all citizens.

Moreover look the airport passenger traffic growth in delhi,mumbai and many other airports.Delhi 21% Oops...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_busiest_airports_by_passenger_traffic
 
The price of the Beijing-Shanghai high-speed rail 2nd class seat is about $6.4 per hundred kilometers and there are 44 couple of trains between the two cities every day, about 400000 passengers per day.China's high-speed rail fares are the cheapest in the world.But there are still a lot of people who can't afford the price.Your high-speed rail fare should not be cheaper than this.


Why "Should Not" ???

Do you seriously think China is the one who can dictate terms to us ??? LOL :p:
 
Please go through EY report. And do care to read the section "China and India: tomorrow’s middle classes" answers for all your doubts are in this. :)

http://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/Hitting_the_sweet_spot/$FILE/Hitting_the_sweet_spot.pdf

A report written more than five years ago, when India looked promising. The prediction hasn't come true.

Why "Should Not" ???

Do you seriously think China is the one who can dictate terms to us ??? LOL :p:

Well, America is the other country that dictates terms to India. Russia does it sometimes as well.
 
A report written more than five years ago, when India looked promising. The prediction hasn't come true.

Agreed, we don't have a robust economy or even middle class, everyone here in India are poor and below poverty line. LOL :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Well, America is the other country that dictates terms to India. Russia does it sometimes as well.

Well you are free to live in your (fools) paradise, I'm not here to burst your bubble. :p:
 
Flights, Computers, Mobile phones and even metros....all were termed 'for elites' In India in their times. We can't be hostage of over 'socialist' views which is a failure in world wide.
 
Why "Should Not" ???

Do you seriously think China is the one who can dictate terms to us ??? LOL :p:
What do you think is the price of Indian high-speed rail?Comprehensive consideration of the operating costs of the railway, the cost of labor, and the prices that people can accept.The cost of air transportation on the same line.the price of high-speed rail should be similar to that of air fares, or even higher.But how many people in your country are willing to pay such a high price?How many people in your country can afford a plane ticket?If there is no sufficient passengers flow, how can the railway be profitable?Can your government endure a huge loss every year?Does your railway department have the ability to operate this new rail well?Do you think the Japanese will sell you something at a loss?
 

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