F-35 EOSDAS

[CanadianPad]

Have a look at this video.
Seems like the dogfight days are over.

F-35 EO DAS Video

 

[Luftwaffe]

Duh i rather buy a futuristic stealth Rafale instead of this over weight whale.

 

[PAFAce]

Duh i rather buy a futuristic stealth Rafale instead of this over weight whale.

What? there is no contest, sir. The overwieght whale is quite an impressive fighting machine, and is already as "futuristic" as anything else.

Also, regarding the video, the EODAS and other advance systems of the F-35 Lightning and the F-22 Raptor sound very simple in videos, a bunch of IR sensors here, a style re-design there and thats it, but man is it tough to implement these systems.

Just as an example, I wonder how many people know this, but VTOL aircraft have some of the most complex control systems imaginable. In particular, the process by which a plane moves from Vertical-Take-Off to Forward-Flight is still an intensive research area and is regarded as one of the most difficult problems in all of Control Theory. There is a very good reason why these aircraft are said to have ushered in an entirely new generation, and it has as much to do with stealth as the bubble-canopy did with the F-16. Ask a fighter pilot who've flown these aircraft and he'll tell you what's what. I could go on talking about these machines and their technology all day, but I fear I might say something that I can not justify, so I'll stop here.

Edit: CanadianPad, I bet you can't wait to see these beasts in Canadian colours. I would love to see them during the Air Show in Toronto piloted by Canadians.

 

[Zob]

see F-35 is a great fighter agreed but see the AMericans are going for STEALTH while the eurpoeans are going for fast quick precision in the form of EURO FIGHTER....clearly europeans r not dumb they must have a good reason why not to opt for stealth yet!besides there is a special G-suite designed for eurofighter

 

[metalfalcon]

Duh i rather buy a futuristic stealth Rafale instead of this over weight whale.

The Futuristic Rafale is Not Available now BUT this Over Weight Whale is a Reality and is One of the Best Jets of Modern Era. F-35 is a well deserved Successor of F-16's Legacy.

 

[metalfalcon]

Just as an example, I wonder how many people know this, but VTOL aircraft have some of the most complex control systems imaginable. In particular, the process by which a plane moves from Vertical-Take-Off to Forward-Flight is still an intensive research area and is regarded as one of the most difficult problems in all of Control Theory. There is a very good reason why these aircraft are said to have ushered in an entirely new generation,

Engineers Make Everything Simple But Only Engineers Know how Difficult it was to make Such a move Look Simple and Ordinary. It took Years of Hard work of Engineers and then after some much Struggle and Hard work they came up with this Marvelous jet which is Capable of Vertical take off but Someone Just says I don't Like it......well its not a Good Thing to say if you Truly knew how it was made.

 

[CanadianPad]

What?
Edit: CanadianPad, I bet you can't wait to see these beasts in Canadian colours. I would love to see them during the Air Show in Toronto piloted by Canadians.

Two years ago the Raptor came to the Toronto Airshow.
Its show was amazing. It performed all those maneuvers that SU's are famous for....and man was it loud !!!
It came after the F-16 but the Viper had nothing on him....it was just awesome.
Whale or not... but the aircraft is amazing and it is the best in the World.

I am sure F-35 will be an excellent addition to the CAF and i will definitely go to any airshow these beasts are performing.

Toronto Air Show 2007 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

 

[hj786]

The DAS system is impressive. Can't be too difficult for China to come up with something similar, there will already be sensors on the J-10B/FC-20 airframe providing missile approach warning. Switch them to IRS&T/FLIR sensors and integrate them into the cockpit and helmet-mounted displays, radar and IFF system. How hard can it be?

 

[PAFAce]

How hard can it be?

Are you a fan of the BBC show Top Gear? They use the words "How hard can it be?" every time they embark on a new project. It's hillarious. I just thought that it was quite funny the way you ended with that question.

Now, to answer your query, I am sure you know this already, but these types of "new" systems are quite difficult to engineer. However, I don't see any reason why the Chinese (or even Pakistanis, for that matter) can't also produce something similar. It's not a question of capability, its a question of resources and motivation, i.e., whether there is a real need for the system and the availability of finances, engineers, scientists, skilled labour etc., that is all. The Chinese certainly have the resources (which the Pakistais may not due to our relatively young aerospace industry), it all depends on whether they have the "need". In short, it is not out of the question for them to be able to produce their own version of this system if they wanted to.

CanadianPad:
I was very pumped to see the F-22 during the airshow in 2007, but unfortunately, a family emergency came up and I couldn't go on any of the three days (I was in Scarborough General Hospital on all 3 days attending to the emergency and looked out the window every opportunity I got, but I didn't see any planes. Scarborough is just too damn far away). It was heartbreaking to miss the F-22, but thankfully the family emergency got better. The year before, too, they had the F-22 (I think), but I wasn't aware of that until after the fact. Let's hope we see an F-35 this year. Even if they don't, they usually always feature the CF-18, F-16, Snowbirds (one of the best aerobatics teams in the world), and vintage planes like the Spitfire, Mustang, Sabre etc. InshAllah, I will go this year for sure.

 

[hj786]

Are you a fan of the BBC show Top Gear? They use the words "How hard can it be?" every time they embark on a new project. It's hillarious. I just thought that it was quite funny the way you ended with that question.

Some say he has seen every episode of Top Gear 10 times, and that he roams the internet at night looking for internet arguments on JF-17. All we know is, he's NOT the stig. But he IS the stig's Pakistani cousin!

Now, to answer your query, I am sure you know this already, but these types of "new" systems are quite difficult to engineer. However, I don't see any reason why the Chinese (or even Pakistanis, for that matter) can't also produce something similar. It's not a question of capability, its a question of resources and motivation, i.e., whether there is a real need for the system and the availability of finances, engineers, scientists, skilled labour etc., that is all. The Chinese certainly have the resources (which the Pakistais may not due to our relatively young aerospace industry), it all depends on whether they have the "need". In short, it is not out of the question for them to be able to produce their own version of this system if they wanted to.

Agreed. I believe if Pakistan got the latest IRST sensors from an outside source they could integrate them into JF-17, the only obstacle being money. There are plenty of programmers and engineers, judging by Pakistan's ballistic/cruise missile projects. There may even be a Pakistani IRST/FLIR sensor design that can be developed to be (if not already) capable enough - I found this on the Pakdef website:
Pakistan Military Consortium :: www.PakDef.info
Also, don't forget the H-2/H-4 glide bombs use infra-red imaging sensors in their nose to identify the target, if the tech. for these was transferred to Pakistan then it may be useful.

 

[metalfalcon]

Are you a fan of the BBC show Top Gear? They use the words "How hard can it be?" every time they embark on a new project. It's hillarious. I just thought that it was quite funny the way you ended with that question.

Now, to answer your query, I am sure you know this already, but these types of "new" systems are quite difficult to engineer. However, I don't see any reason why the Chinese (or even Pakistanis, for that matter) can't also produce something similar. It's not a question of capability, its a question of resources and motivation, i.e., whether there is a real need for the system and the availability of finances, engineers, scientists, skilled labour etc., that is all. The Chinese certainly have the resources (which the Pakistais may not due to our relatively young aerospace industry), it all depends on whether they have the "need". In short, it is not out of the question for them to be able to produce their own version of this system if they wanted to.

CanadianPad:
I was very pumped to see the F-22 during the airshow in 2007, but unfortunately, a family emergency came up and I couldn't go on any of the three days (I was in Scarborough General Hospital on all 3 days attending to the emergency and looked out the window every opportunity I got, but I didn't see any planes. Scarborough is just too damn far away). It was heartbreaking to miss the F-22, but thankfully the family emergency got better. The year before, too, they had the F-22 (I think), but I wasn't aware of that until after the fact. Let's hope we see an F-35 this year. Even if they don't, they usually always feature the CF-18, F-16, Snowbirds (one of the best aerobatics teams in the world), and vintage planes like the Spitfire, Mustang, Sabre etc. InshAllah, I will go this year for sure.

Pakistan will soon Inshallah Have a Strong and well Settled Infrastructure to Manufacture state of art Aircrafts, JF-17 Thunder is not Everything, its Just the Beginning There is lot More to Come. As the Chinese say that.

The Journey of Thousand Miles Begins with a Single step.

We Lack Resources but Not Motivation. We Lack Skills But not Talent. We Lack Leadership But not Unity.

I hope Next time you will be able to see that Air Show in Canada wish you all the Best and I hope that you will witness the best aerobatics in the History of Canada.

 

[PAFAce]

Thank you hj786, I agree with 100%. You have beaten me in Top Gear watching, but only slightly. I have all the episodes from all 11 seasons and have probably watched some of them five times.

Metalfalcon, thanks a lot buddy. There is still a long time until the next Canadian Airshow (end of September). Before then, InshAllah, we will all watch a great aerobatics display in Pakistan on 23rd March, 2009. I really hope someone with HD records the entire parade and puts it up on this website.

 

[ALi Rizwan]

see F-35 is a great fighter agreed but see the AMericans are going for STEALTH while the eurpoeans are going for fast quick precision in the form of EURO FIGHTER....clearly europeans r not dumb they must have a good reason why not to opt for stealth yet!besides there is a special G-suite designed for eurofighter

europien wil use F-35 as a front-line fighter
f-35 5th generation
typhoon 4.5 generation

 

[Luftwaffe]

so 5th generation is just stealth??surely rfale and ef2000's avionics will go 5th generation within few years..

 

[mean_bird]

so 5th generation is just stealth??surely rfale and ef2000's avionics will go 5th generation within few years..

Well, F-22...the only currently 5th gen fighter today...is more than just stealth. It incorporates very advanced sensors, electronics, etc.

Key to the F/A-22's capabilities is a complex of passive sensors, basically for electronic surveillance, that line the outside edges of the fighter's wings and tail surfaces. They gather electronic emissions at frequencies up to 18 GHz., sort them by time and angle of arrival for location, and analyze the signature automatically for rapid identification. Electronic data are fused with detailed RCS signatures gathered by the radar for additional identification.

F-22 Secrets Revealed

February 12, 2009: The U.S. Air Force has released some performance data on the F-22. The stealthiness factor of the F-22 has turned out to be better than predicted. For radar purposes, the F-22 is about the size of a steel marble. The F-35 comes out as a steel golf ball. The AESA radar turned out to have a longer effective range of about 210 kilometers, versus a 200 on the official spec sheet. The AESA radar is also able to detect enemy radars at a considerable distance, meaning that, if an approaching enemy aircraft is using its radar, an F-22 can detect it about 300 kilometers distant. That gives the F-22 more time to get into position for a decisive first shot at the enemy aircraft.

These goodies are being released as the air force makes a pitch to delay some F-35 production in order to build more F-22s. The air force generals point out that the first 500 or so F-35s will cost $200 million each (without taking R&D into account), while F-22s only cost $145 million each (without taking R&D into account). The construction cost of the F-35 will eventually go to about $100 million each as more are produced.

The air force also points out that their simulations (which are classified, so it's difficult for anyone check their accuracy) indicate the an F-22 would destroy 30 Su-27/MiG-29 type aircraft for getting destroyed. But the F-35 would only have a 3:1 ratio, while the F-15 and F-16 would only have a 1:1 ratio (there are a lot of F-15 and F-16 pilots who would dispute this). Thus the need for more F-22s, even if it means fewer F-35s (in the near and long term).

The air force also points out that, with a force of 183 F-22s (all Congress will allow them to build at the moment), only about a hundred would be available for combat (the rest would be down for maintenance or used for training.) By building another 60-100 F-22s, and reducing initial F-35 production by that much, American air superiority would be much improved, at no (well, not much) additional expense. Or so goes the pitch.