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Gandhi the real Gandhi. EXPOSED!

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Gandhi is historical leader, he is among the great leaders of the world, without his contribution and Jinnah's contribution India would never have achieved Independence from British

thats not true... Britian had no interest in india after WWII, it was getting too hectic for them to control such a huge empire and shrunk back to couple of islands and main land..
 
I don't find the topic of much interest... but its a topic, nonetheless and its commentary upon a political figure. With politics comes criticism. We'll watch it closely, though.

Will be shifted to the appropriate section. Enough with the urine, 23march, lots of people drank urine in history, its no big deal. It was considered medicinal.

is gandi not part of indian history? so why is this thread moved to members club?
 
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What a charismatic post from the most civilized person of this forum.
No wonder, most indecent members have refrained from posting.

Way to go !

Internet is the battle field for the new brave men of this generation who cannot do in in the real battle.
 
What a charismatic post from the most civilized person of this forum.
No wonder, most indecent members have refrained from posting.

Way to go !

Internet is the battle field for the new brave men of this generation who cannot do in in the real battle.

Hindustan has the world's largest democracy, the world's largest number of poor people, largest number of illiterates, largest number of hungry, world leader in urine therapy, longest uninterrupted history of military defeats at hands of foreigners, being ruled by foreigners even today, most of its legal, education, military, scientific, technological, entertainment, sport and other fields of endeavour being shaped by its most recent master of 200 years - UK! India was the most loyal of britain's servants and had sent millions of 'volunteer' (servants) to serve her master Britain, and many thousand Indians died to please her master UK. This is nation of Gandhis that now wields million 'weak' armed forces and nukes, despite the above FACTS! World's largest democracy in action!
 
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Hindustan has the world's largest democracy,

by virtue of its population

the world's largest number of poor people,

by virtue of its population

largest number of illiterates,

by virtue of its population

largest number of hungry

by virtue of its population

world leader in urine therapy,

I would like a source for this, though I have heard that Japs have taken to it in a big way...

but in any case by virtue of its population.

Romans used Urine to whiten their teeth btw..

longest uninterrupted history of military defeats at hands of foreigners,

To an extent true but most of the foreigners ended up being Indianized except the British...
The later Mughals had Indian blood for eg.

being ruled by foreigners even today,

How? and Ruler? Is India not a democracy?

Dr.Singh & Mrs. Shekhwat Patil is as Indian as they come.

most of its legal, education, military, scientific, technological, entertainment, sport and other fields of endeavour being shaped by its most recent master of 200 years - UK!

To an extent quite true and for this I give the devil its due...

India was the most loyal of britain's servants and had sent millions of 'volunteer' (servants) to serve her master Britain, and many thousand Indians died to please her master UK.

Undivided India was not the most loyal IMO but the largest contributor of men in both World Wars.. and for this I am glad that Indians were able to defeat the Italians, Persians, Turks, Chinese, Egyptians, Germans etc. proved that Indians with the right training, equipment are the most devastating..


This is nation of Gandhis that now wields million 'weak' armed forces and nukes, despite the above FACTS! World's largest democracy in action!

Also the Nation of Chisti, Siddhartha, Buddha, Nanak etc.

Gandhi said its better to wield weapons than practice non-violence if you don't have the fortitude to follow non-violence.. so the world's biggest non-hypocrite nation as well..
 
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I would like a source for this, though I have heard that Japs have taken to it in a big way...
but in any case by virtue of its population.
Romans used Urine to whiten their teeth btw..


"Recently the BJP ruled Uttarakhand Government (Feb 2008) has announced that it will procure cow’s urine, on the pattern similar to the procurement of milk by dairies, refine
it and sell it to Ayurvedic pharmacies. Other BJP ruled Governments are also working on similar lines."

The urine, which is being sold under the label "Gift of the Cow", is being enthusiastically promoted by the government of Gujarat, one of three states in India dominated by Hindu nationalists.
Advertised as being "sterilised and completely fresh" it is available for 20 rupees (30p) a bottle at about 50 centres run by the VHP in Gujerat, from 200 of their outlets in neighbouring Madhya Pradesh, and at fairs and religious festivals throughout India.
It also comes in tablets or a cream mixed with other traditional medicinal herbs. Demand is currently outstripping supply.


Undivided India was not the most loyal IMO but the largest contributor of men in both World Wars.. and for this I am glad that Indians were able to defeat the Italians, Persians, Turks, Chinese, Egyptians, Germans etc. proved that Indians with the right training, equipment are the most devastating..

Which comic book are you referring to? BharatRakshak?

Gandhi said its better to wield weapons than practice non-violence if you don't have the fortitude to follow non-violence.. so the world's biggest non-hypocrite nation as well..

here is one enlighting quote for you my friend..
During a prayer speech: “If we had the atom bomb, we would have used it against
the British.” - June 16, 1947 (Reference: Gandhi’s “The Last Phase”, Vol II, p. 326)
 

Doesn't say that India is the largest consumer of Urine though.. whether human, Cow or Camel.. and Cow Urine and Cow dung are commonly used as disinfectants etc. in villages of the Indian subcontinent..

though scientists are trying to convert sewage water to potable water.. and NASA astronauts to drink their own piss..

Which comic book are you referring to? BharatRakshak?

Not referring to any comic books but history..

here is one enlighting quote for you my friend..
During a prayer speech: “If we had the atom bomb, we would have used it against
the British.” - June 16, 1947 (Reference: Gandhi’s “The Last Phase”, Vol II, p. 326)

Gandhi also made this famous quote : depriving the Indians of Arms was the greatest misdeed of the British Govt..
Wouldn't you use all that is available to you to protect your own nation, family, people, pride??
My respect for Mahatma Gandhi has risen not diminished.. what a great man..
Non violence doesn't mean weakness btw..
 
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Gandhi was definitely a scumbag. Though I don't think that writing a letter to Hitler was considered a particularly bad thing at the time (though those quotes are a bit racial). It just makes me think more and more he was serving the interests of foreign powers.

He really didn't do anything to gain India's independence. He just prolonged the colonial rule by suppressing the desire to rebel and fight back of the natives. Result was 200 years of colonialism and a messed up economy. Bose, on the other hands, actually met with Hitler, and in my opinion, contributed to Indian independence, unlike Gandhi by instigating the Burma campaigns (incidentally Bose could not have done much without the help of the Pathans from Pakistan to get him out of the subcontinent and into Europe).
 
Gandhi is historical leader, he is among the great leaders of the world, without his contribution and Jinnah's contribution India would never have achieved Independence from British, what happened during his non-violence camping was not to be blamed entirely on Gandhi people around him were more involved in the violence that erupted through out India against Muslims, his vision was for a united India where both races could live to gather something that even Jinnah had once agreed upon however, in the end we must take the Right decision to what would make both nations prosperous, Gandhi himself was murdered by Hindu Fundamentalist, if anything these fundamentalist are to blame for India's involvement in racial attacks. Nehru during his tenure tried to out law them but with little success.

This just has too many layers of ignorance to be corrected.

Firstly, without Gandhi, India would have achieved independence much quicker.

Secondly, What are the "both races" you refer to?

Thirdly, You think Hindus and Muslims in India would have been treated equally? Gandhi knew perfectly well Muslims would not get equal treatment in India, yet he wanted to keep them there.

Ridiculously ignorant comments.
 
Dear Malang

Debate and Discussion is meaningful only when we debate with someone with reasonable mind .. someone who is willing to understand the truth .
As Kant said Perception is reflection of our purpose .
What can you expect from people who grew on hatred .. people who are taught prejudice and no wonder that nation is regarded as one of the the most dangerous nation in the world . no wonder they are still struggling to understand and establish democracy .

Pakistan: The Most Dangerous? | Newsweek International | Newsweek.com

I see these nonsensical allegation and charges on Gandhi as the by product of negative emotions on which the entire society grew and this is reflected in there present state .

http://www.dawn.com/2008/08/09/letted.htm

THIS is about a serious problem faced by thousands of Pakistanis residing in Spain, i.e. procuring ‘character certificates’ that Spanish immigration officials demand.For work permission and acquiring a residence permit, there should be a valid police character certificate attested by the related country’s police.Previously, Pakistan used to have district and provincial police besides the national police. But now the Spanish government passed a new law that every Pakistani should submit a character certificate attested by the national police — not the district or provincial police — with other necessary documents.Therefore, all work and residence applications of the Pakistanis, who have spent three years is Spain, are rejected. For the last six months the government of Spain has forwarded these conditions to the Pakistani embassy in Madrid and the Pakistan consulate-general in Barcelona. But here in Spain the designated Pakistani ambassador and the consul general are not serious about this important matter.Many Pakistanis protested peacefully in front of the Pakistan consulate-general in Barcelona to highlight their problems but received no response from the officials concerned

MANZAR WAHEED Madrid, Spain

J. N.
Dixit, former Indian foreign secretary has spoken of the
psychological hurdles that come in the way of Indian and
Pakistani relations. These are listed in a review of his
book (44):
Dixit identifies a series of Pakistani traits that refuse
to live amicably with India. First, "artificially
nurtured memories of Muslim superiority and a
subconscious desire to rectify the unfair arrangements of
partition". Second, a certain envy Pakistanis would not
acknowledge openly about the failure of their civil
45
society to solidify democratic and tolerant traditions in
comparison to an India where khakis and bayonets follow
popularly elected representatives. Third, assumption by
Pakistan of the role of protector and overseer of the
welfare of Indian Muslims, who in the words of Maulana
Azad, could be exploited from forces across the border
owing to their "socio-political schizophrenia" since
partition. Fourth, avenging the military defeat of 1971,
which is a formal objective declared in the official
oath-taking ceremony of every Pakistani officer-cadet
when he graduates.

Gandhi is like Sun .. People with sane mind take light from him .. people with insanity curse him ..

There insanity has make Pakistan reach where it has reached .. War on terror has reached Pakistan .. and seriously people who dislike Pakistan smile when they see people with so much hatred and prejudice .
 
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Quoting further from the Nayyar and Salim report:
29


Four themes emerge most strongly..
1. ... Pakistan is for Muslims alone;
2. ...Islamiat is to be forcibly taught to all the
students, whatever their faith, including a compulsory
reading of Qur'an;
3. that Ideology of Pakistan is to be internalized as
faith, and hate be created against Hindus and India;
4. and students are to be urged to take the path of Jehad
and Shahadat (martrydom).
Associated with the insistence on the Ideology of
Pakistan has been an essential component of hate against
India and the Hindus...the existence of Pakistan is
defined only in relation to Hindus, and hence the Hindus
have to be painted as black as possible.
Curriculum documents ask the following as the specific
learning objectives:
The child should be able to understand the Hindu and
Muslim differences...India's evil designs against
Pakistan ..Hindu has always been an enemy of Islam.
The class II Urdu book has a lesson on "Our Country", the
first sentences of which read: Our country is Pakistan.
...Pakistan is an Islamic country. Here Muslims live.
Muslims believe in the unity of Allah. They do good
deeds.
The Class 6 book says: Who am I? I am a Muslim. I am a
Pakistani...you are a Muslim and your religion is Islam.
A book lists "Acchi baten" (good deeds). Among them:
"Good people are those who read the Qur'an and teach the
Qur'an to others" implying that those of another faith
cannot be good people.

In another article on Pakistani education AH Nayyar wrote
(21):
The class 4 text book states: The religion of the Hindus
did not teach them good things -- Hindus did not respect
women...
Another book tells the students:
Hindus worship in temples which are very narrow and dark
places, where they worship idols. Only one person can
enter the temple at a time. In our mosques, on the other
31
hand, all Muslims can say their prayers together.
For another, the Hindus as a monolith were always
cunning, scheming, and conspiring to deprive the Muslims
of their due rights.. The Hindus always desired to crush
the Muslims as a nation. Several attempts were made by
the Hindus to erase the Muslim culture and civilization
...
If the Hindus had any national aspirations then these
were clearly a sign of their prejudices, while if the
Muslim kings and invaders plundered Hindu temples then
presumably they did so with very noble intentions.
The experience of colonialism is described in a textbook
as a British-Hindu conspiracy: The British joined forces
with the Hindus to bring harm to the Muslims. Muslims
tried in every way to maintain good relations with the
British and Hindus, but they did not allow it to be so.
Regarding history as taught to Pakistani children Kamila
Hyat wrote in the Jang in August 2003 (22):
.. the terrible events that led to the breaking away of
East Pakistan and the creation of Bangladesh are never
mentioned...
Members of the generation who grew up after 1971 often
have no idea at all of what issues underpinned the civil
war or why it took place. The genocide committed in the
territory that now constitutes Bangladesh .. are hardly
ever discussed or even spoken off on passing within the
Pakistan of today.
Pervez Hoodbhoy, a Pakistani scientist writes (23):
At the completion of Class-V, the child should be able to "Make speeches on Jehad and Shahadat"
"Understand Hindu-Muslim differences and the resultant
need for Pakistan."
"India's evil designs against Pakistan."
Hoodbhoy goes on to say in the same article:
A moronic, incompetent, self-obsessed, corrupt, and
ideologically charged education bureaucracy today
squarely blocks Pakistan's entry into the 21st century.
It is clear from this that it is not only the madrassas
that offer a curriculum of hatred to Pakistani children.
Even children who study in Pakistani state schools imbibe
a curriculum of discrimination and hate.
The real worry in having such a faulty educational system "Make speeches on Jehad and Shahadat"
"Understand Hindu-Muslim differences and the resultant
need for Pakistan."
"India's evil designs against Pakistan."
Hoodbhoy goes on to say in the same article:
A moronic, incompetent, self-obsessed, corrupt, and
ideologically charged education bureaucracy today
squarely blocks Pakistan's entry into the 21st century.
It is clear from this that it is not only the madrassas
that offer a curriculum of hatred to Pakistani children.
Even children who study in Pakistani state schools imbibe
a curriculum of discrimination and hate.
 
This just has too many layers of ignorance to be corrected.

Firstly, without Gandhi, India would have achieved independence much quicker.

Secondly, What are the "both races" you refer to?

Thirdly, You think Hindus and Muslims in India would have been treated equally? Gandhi knew perfectly well Muslims would not get equal treatment in India, yet he wanted to keep them there.

Ridiculously ignorant comments.
Even though there were hinderances placed in by Gandhi, especially when the Pakistan demand came in, you cannot say that without Gandhi it would've happened much quicker.

He managed to at the very least antagonize the British in the eyes of the Indians. He really didn't full fledgedly demand for full independence till Jinnah wanted a Full independent Pakistan which was wrong.

Also note, that his antics, dramatic symbolizations, led Jinnah to get frustrated by him and actually break away!

Jinnah himself thus was a by-product of the good and the bad of Gandhi.
 
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