Zaheerkhan
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Few Americans are qualified to speak on Al Qaeda, the Mumbai terrorist attacks, the Middle-East, and Islam at one go. Bernard Haykel is one such expert.
Haykel has an interesting background. His father is a Christian of Lebanese origin from the West Indies; his mother a Polish Jew who survived the Holocaust. You can call Haykel India's son-in-law as well since he is married to Navina, former foreign secretary Salman Haider's daughter.
Now an American citizen, Haykel graduated from Oxford in Islamic studies and is currently writing a book on the evolution and impact of the Wahabbi and Salafi movements on Saudi Arabia since the 1950s. His passion is to study and teach Islamic politics, and he has been doing that for the last two years as professor of Near Eastern Studies at Princeton University.
An interesting side to Haykel is that he is defending the legal and human rights of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the prime accused in the 9/11 attacks who faces a military trial at the US prison facility in Guantanamo Bay.
Haykel spoke to Sheela Bhatt in this exclusive interview about the Mumbai attacks, Al Qaeda and, of course, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.
Source:rediff.com: Bernard Haykel: Mumbai is a model for future terrorist attacks
What was your reaction when you heard about the Mumbai attacks?
It was a real shock. I saw that terrorists had attacked multiple sites, and sites of symbolic importance. There was something different about the attack. People who were doing so were influenced by Al Qaeda led by Osama bin Laden. There was simultaneous attacks on different locations, they were targeting American, British and Israeli citizens. They are known targets of Al Qaeda.
The attack was aimed to stop Mumbai's international commerce, also. They wanted businessmen to think twice or thrice before coming to Mumbai. Lastly, I strongly found Al Qaeda here because I have been following Al Qaeda's Web site for several years. Often India, not just Kashmir, is mentioned.
Al Qaeda knows that India has a kind of soft underbelly, a soft spot, a weak spot unlike America, unlike Europe and other places like Saudi Arabia where many of the targets have been hardened and made difficult to attack.
India remains a soft target.
I thought this would be a major victory for the ideologues of Al Qaeda. Even if Al Qaeda itself has not commanded this act, it had all the hallmarks of it. At the end of 60 hours, when we were told that there were only 10 people and they were able to capture the media's attention for three days, I find it very worrying. Because, this will become a template, a model for future attacks that would be very spectacular on one hand and very cheap on other.
Al Qaeda has been very worried and troubled that they could not do any attack after 9/11, 2001 that was spectacular. It requires huge energy and resources. I feel Mumbai allowed them to find a cheap way to do something spectacular, again. For all these reasons it is a bad omen for the world. It is a terrible tragedy.
India will have to prepare for many more attacks like this. India will have to do something to prevent something like this from happening again. Or at least India should try to minimise the impact of such attacks.
Why do you say that many more attacks are possible?
Because, you have remained unprepared.
There is a friend who belongs to British intelligence. He told me a year ago when the attacks happened in London and Glasgow they found that Indians were involved in it. This officer follows British connection to Al Qaeda, its sympathisers and followers. He follows also what is going on within India.
He came to New Delhi this year. He told the authorities here that 'You have a real problem with young, radicalised, highly educated middle class people'. They are not just in India but they are also in other places in Europe.
India should be careful about the possibility of big attacks. At that time, according to him, the Indian authorities didn't take his warning seriously. I see definitely a trend. Muslims youth who are radicalised in India, in Pakistan, in the Middle East or in Europe, they see India as a soft target.
What is the best way for India to get out of this Al Qaeda vortex?
For India a question of what happens in Pakistan -- if Pakistan is going to become a failed State, or will it continue being used by the jihadis to attack India or within Pakistan -- has to be resolved. That has to be India's number one priority. Also, a situation in Afghanistan is the major issue and it has to be resolved.
I think America's policy wanting to occupy and impose regime on Afghanistan is not the right policy. I don't think it's a policy that would succeed. I don't know what could be the real solution for the region. I am quite pessimistic, actually, in the short term.
Do you think the Indo-US relationship, that has grown manifold in the last four-and-a-half years, is also one the reasons for India becoming a sharper target for Al Qaeda?
Certainly. Al Qaeda says so. Not only the relationship between India and the US, but the relationship between India and Israel is a reason. Jihadists take it as proof that India is also an enemy of Islam. They use this kind of an argument.
At one profound level one has to realise that India is no longer an equal partner with Pakistan. India has grown much bigger and much stronger and much more prominent in the world.
Pakistanis have an obsession with India. They want to think of an India as an equal in rivalry. But both are not equal. India has surpassed Pakistan. And India is not a failed State. India is moving in the right direction and India might become a superpower in the future.
Pakistan is an irritant to its neighbour and you will have to find ways to minimise the damage to yourself. Pakistan can damage itself too. Finding a formula for this situation is not an easy thing.
As an outsider and a Westerner, how do you see India managing the Hindu-Muslim relationship? Do you think for the sake of its national interest India will be able to achieve a balance?
Absolutely. I think the formula that you have here, to have a secular government which recognises the rights of the religious minority, is the right formula. You can improve on it, perhaps you can give quotas to uplift your minorities, you can put more attention in improving their social-economical conditions because there are groups who have been left out of the success story of India, but there is no question that India is the successful model.
It is remarkable to see how many different communities you have in this country. Occasionally you have problems but by and large you get on. You are tolerating each other. And I think that is a fantastic thing. Pakistan should learn a lesson from it.
What would be India's best diplomatic response to the Mumbai attacks?
I think India should be extremely careful to not to provoke Pakistan into doing stupid things. I think at the moment Pakistan is very liable to a rash, intemperate and inconsiderate policy. It is very important that India should corner Pakistan, but also let Pakistan realise that there is a way out of the corner.
India has behaved well. It has not moved its army to the borders, not threatened war. India must try to get as many countries, specially the US and Saudi Arabia, to put pressure on Pakistan to realise that at least Pakistan's military and intelligence can no longer function like business as usual -- basically supporting the terrorists to attack Kashmir or other parts of India like Mumbai.
I think there has to be a carrot and stick approach. You should try to get Pakistanis out of their obsession of 'We are against India and Indians are against us.' There seems to be a very unhealthy dynamic.
Hearing this argument many Indians will say that India was badly hit, 174 Indian lives were lost, India is the victim, and now the world wants only India to be 'responsible', the world wants to control India's response and let only India uphold grand values.
But, then, you are a great power. A great power like India has to behave responsibly. As a great power America has behaved stupidly and irresponsibly. We have a huge problem in Iraq. India can learn lessons from the United States by being disciplined and responsible.
The next segment of this interview will be posted next week.
Great neutral prospective about the Mumbai terror attacks.!!!
Haykel has an interesting background. His father is a Christian of Lebanese origin from the West Indies; his mother a Polish Jew who survived the Holocaust. You can call Haykel India's son-in-law as well since he is married to Navina, former foreign secretary Salman Haider's daughter.
Now an American citizen, Haykel graduated from Oxford in Islamic studies and is currently writing a book on the evolution and impact of the Wahabbi and Salafi movements on Saudi Arabia since the 1950s. His passion is to study and teach Islamic politics, and he has been doing that for the last two years as professor of Near Eastern Studies at Princeton University.
An interesting side to Haykel is that he is defending the legal and human rights of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the prime accused in the 9/11 attacks who faces a military trial at the US prison facility in Guantanamo Bay.
Haykel spoke to Sheela Bhatt in this exclusive interview about the Mumbai attacks, Al Qaeda and, of course, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.
Source:rediff.com: Bernard Haykel: Mumbai is a model for future terrorist attacks
What was your reaction when you heard about the Mumbai attacks?
It was a real shock. I saw that terrorists had attacked multiple sites, and sites of symbolic importance. There was something different about the attack. People who were doing so were influenced by Al Qaeda led by Osama bin Laden. There was simultaneous attacks on different locations, they were targeting American, British and Israeli citizens. They are known targets of Al Qaeda.
The attack was aimed to stop Mumbai's international commerce, also. They wanted businessmen to think twice or thrice before coming to Mumbai. Lastly, I strongly found Al Qaeda here because I have been following Al Qaeda's Web site for several years. Often India, not just Kashmir, is mentioned.
Al Qaeda knows that India has a kind of soft underbelly, a soft spot, a weak spot unlike America, unlike Europe and other places like Saudi Arabia where many of the targets have been hardened and made difficult to attack.
India remains a soft target.
I thought this would be a major victory for the ideologues of Al Qaeda. Even if Al Qaeda itself has not commanded this act, it had all the hallmarks of it. At the end of 60 hours, when we were told that there were only 10 people and they were able to capture the media's attention for three days, I find it very worrying. Because, this will become a template, a model for future attacks that would be very spectacular on one hand and very cheap on other.
Al Qaeda has been very worried and troubled that they could not do any attack after 9/11, 2001 that was spectacular. It requires huge energy and resources. I feel Mumbai allowed them to find a cheap way to do something spectacular, again. For all these reasons it is a bad omen for the world. It is a terrible tragedy.
India will have to prepare for many more attacks like this. India will have to do something to prevent something like this from happening again. Or at least India should try to minimise the impact of such attacks.
Why do you say that many more attacks are possible?
Because, you have remained unprepared.
There is a friend who belongs to British intelligence. He told me a year ago when the attacks happened in London and Glasgow they found that Indians were involved in it. This officer follows British connection to Al Qaeda, its sympathisers and followers. He follows also what is going on within India.
He came to New Delhi this year. He told the authorities here that 'You have a real problem with young, radicalised, highly educated middle class people'. They are not just in India but they are also in other places in Europe.
India should be careful about the possibility of big attacks. At that time, according to him, the Indian authorities didn't take his warning seriously. I see definitely a trend. Muslims youth who are radicalised in India, in Pakistan, in the Middle East or in Europe, they see India as a soft target.
What is the best way for India to get out of this Al Qaeda vortex?
For India a question of what happens in Pakistan -- if Pakistan is going to become a failed State, or will it continue being used by the jihadis to attack India or within Pakistan -- has to be resolved. That has to be India's number one priority. Also, a situation in Afghanistan is the major issue and it has to be resolved.
I think America's policy wanting to occupy and impose regime on Afghanistan is not the right policy. I don't think it's a policy that would succeed. I don't know what could be the real solution for the region. I am quite pessimistic, actually, in the short term.
Do you think the Indo-US relationship, that has grown manifold in the last four-and-a-half years, is also one the reasons for India becoming a sharper target for Al Qaeda?
Certainly. Al Qaeda says so. Not only the relationship between India and the US, but the relationship between India and Israel is a reason. Jihadists take it as proof that India is also an enemy of Islam. They use this kind of an argument.
At one profound level one has to realise that India is no longer an equal partner with Pakistan. India has grown much bigger and much stronger and much more prominent in the world.
Pakistanis have an obsession with India. They want to think of an India as an equal in rivalry. But both are not equal. India has surpassed Pakistan. And India is not a failed State. India is moving in the right direction and India might become a superpower in the future.
Pakistan is an irritant to its neighbour and you will have to find ways to minimise the damage to yourself. Pakistan can damage itself too. Finding a formula for this situation is not an easy thing.
As an outsider and a Westerner, how do you see India managing the Hindu-Muslim relationship? Do you think for the sake of its national interest India will be able to achieve a balance?
Absolutely. I think the formula that you have here, to have a secular government which recognises the rights of the religious minority, is the right formula. You can improve on it, perhaps you can give quotas to uplift your minorities, you can put more attention in improving their social-economical conditions because there are groups who have been left out of the success story of India, but there is no question that India is the successful model.
It is remarkable to see how many different communities you have in this country. Occasionally you have problems but by and large you get on. You are tolerating each other. And I think that is a fantastic thing. Pakistan should learn a lesson from it.
What would be India's best diplomatic response to the Mumbai attacks?
I think India should be extremely careful to not to provoke Pakistan into doing stupid things. I think at the moment Pakistan is very liable to a rash, intemperate and inconsiderate policy. It is very important that India should corner Pakistan, but also let Pakistan realise that there is a way out of the corner.
India has behaved well. It has not moved its army to the borders, not threatened war. India must try to get as many countries, specially the US and Saudi Arabia, to put pressure on Pakistan to realise that at least Pakistan's military and intelligence can no longer function like business as usual -- basically supporting the terrorists to attack Kashmir or other parts of India like Mumbai.
I think there has to be a carrot and stick approach. You should try to get Pakistanis out of their obsession of 'We are against India and Indians are against us.' There seems to be a very unhealthy dynamic.
Hearing this argument many Indians will say that India was badly hit, 174 Indian lives were lost, India is the victim, and now the world wants only India to be 'responsible', the world wants to control India's response and let only India uphold grand values.
But, then, you are a great power. A great power like India has to behave responsibly. As a great power America has behaved stupidly and irresponsibly. We have a huge problem in Iraq. India can learn lessons from the United States by being disciplined and responsible.
The next segment of this interview will be posted next week.
Great neutral prospective about the Mumbai terror attacks.!!!
