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PR, Nawaz Sharif, Pakistan's politicians and the democracy dilemma : Why I oppose Nawaz Sharif.

TankMan

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I came across some interesting articles here,
http://www.dawn.com/news/1052293
PML-N’s financial wizardry - Sayem Z Ali
I'm going to be quoting specific parts of these articles here but they're both worth a complete read. This post is meant to explain my, and many, many Pakistanis' point of view, put things in a little perspective and reply to those who wonder that why, despite the apparent failure of the protests and PTI, I continue to oppose the PMLN government.

Pakistan has problems, everybody knows that. But truly understanding what these problems are is a different matter entirely. While gossip and conspiracy theories are really popular among people, the average Pakistani has a vague idea about the politics, the underlying issues behind their problems. What they do see, however, are the 'symptoms'. This makes the people, the masses, really gullible.

On the other hand, we have people who do not understand the plight of the Pakistani people yet believe that they understand the politics. People living in posh areas, or the expatriates spectating from abroad. They may wonder why, despite all the investments and mega-projects and whatnot the current PMLN government has been making, is Pakistan's situation deteriorating? They will also then wonder why people are protesting against the government, surely it is these protests and political unrest that is responsible for the deterioration? Others will be quick to blame the Army for meddling with civilian affairs and 'sabotaging democracy'.

The truth is very different. In order to actually understand the situation, we must see both of the points of view and combine them in an honest analysis.

PMLN, for example, has always made projects, policies and the like to show how much work they are doing. But anyone who has lived in Punjab, their favorite province, can tell how full of lies they are. An outsider may see the 'investments', 'economic reforms', mega projects and schemes and think that Nawaz Sharif is very good. Similarly, An average, relatively uninformed Pakistani will see things like the protests and blame them for undermining Nawaz's efforts.

The truth is that these PR projects do nothing to actually help Pakistanis. On one hand we have them handing out laptops (not to mention all the fraud in this) and on the other we have schools without books or a roof. Then we have mega projects like the Metro Bus (again, not counting the fact that NS benefits from these through his steel mills and other businesses) while Lahore doesn't have a proper sewage and drainage system. PMLN had more than enough time in Punjab to at least fix this. No developed province (or at least a city like Lahore) should flood every time it rains.

Pakistan’s chronic economic issues are affecting the viability of state structures, and can no longer be addressed by prescriptions offered by conventional thinking (of both local and foreign experts), because it mostly focuses on the symptoms, while the rot turns into a gangrenous mess.
Take, for example, the energy crisis. The core problem revolves around the energy mix and the generous terms given to the independent power producers. Subsidy in that context is a misnomer, because it’s a consequence of a structurally flawed energy policy and not a simple case of providing goods below a price determined by the free market.

The 'prescriptions and symptoms' analogy the author is is using here is perfect when we look at Pakistani healthcare. If you go to a clinic, in most places of Pakistan, you'll find 'doctors' giving patients strong drips and injections for small things like a cough or fever. Now what this does is that it convinces poor, uneducated people that they are being given proper treatment and they happily fork out their hard-earned cash. Their symptoms stop, but after a while, thanks to the underlying issue being ignored, their symptoms return, worse than before.

That is precisely the strategy NS uses in Pakistan. Just replace 'injections and drips' with mega-projects and 'patients' with the public and you get an honest analysis of PMLN's performance.

Mr Sharif’s style of personalised governance hasn’t changed much since the 1990s, although Pakistan has become too big and complex — with its society violently fractured and institutions dangerously weak — to be governed by a kitchen cabinet of loyalists and relatives. It must restructure its predatory institutions — particularly the police, lower judiciary, and bureaucracy — through radical reforms to institutionalise governance.
Unfortunately, the federal government is in a limbo for many practical purposes after the devolution of significant powers to the provinces, because while it has taken place on paper, the provinces’ governing capacity is quite limited, as they have long suffered from under-investment and been undermined by a meddling security establishment.
Now over here this author makes a good point, then reverts to milking the old 'security establishment' argument. The truth is that this idea that the Army has been undermining the country is grossly exaggerated. It may have been true in the past but during Kayani's leadership and now Raheel Sharif's, this 'meddling' was talk and almost nothing else. And even when we talk about the past, most of the times it wasn't the Army that caused the downfall of civilian governments - It was the politicians' greed and incompetence that gave the Army reason and opportunity to intervene.

The point about 'on paper' is further backed by the fact that while PMLN boasted a lot about their economic success, the actual facts were stating the contrary, like this author says here:
I would kindly request the PML-N team to read the State Bank of Pakistan’s Handbook of Statistics 2010 to get their facts straight. The tax cuts to big business and wealthy individuals introduced by the first Nawaz Sharif government in 1990 led to a decline in tax collection. Tax to GDP fell from 14.3 percent of GDP in FY90 (fiscal year ending June 1990) to 13.3 percent of GDP in FY93. The second time the Sharif government came to power – in 1997 – it repeated the same mistakes, leading to the same results. Again tax collection declined from 14.4 percent of GDP in FY96 to 13.3 percent in FY99.
They have some short boosts, for a couple of days it feels like everything is going well but one month or two later, everything is back to deteriorating again.

In Punjab around 2009, where PMLN ruled during the previous term, we used to hear things like 'loadshedding will finish by 2012'. In 2012, sitting in the dark and reading a newspaper with a candle, I read that the metro bus project started, all while we had no electricity for upto 18 hours a day. PMLN ruled for a long time and all they did was PR.

With the metro bus, one might argue of its importance or effect but the truth is it cost a lot more than it should have. And this cost is not counting the fact that they demolished countless shops and businesses to make room for it. I was in Lahore and I witnessed shops, bakeries and mosques being demolished. People complained about not getting proper compensation (in some cases, they didn't get any. They're probably still desperately wandering around in courts).
Surprisingly, very less media reported this.
All I found was this:
What price the Azadi | TNS - The News on Sunday
And lets not forget the long-term problems caused by the project:
Is Metro Bus a success story?
What about the cost of maintaining it and running it? What about the practicality of allocating so many resources to it while Pakistan suffers from so many other pertinent issues? It seems like PMLN has left behind a perfect trap for whoever comes in power after them - they will be blamed for the eventual deterioration and ultimately, failure, of the Metro Bus project.

At the end of the day, politicians like Nawaz Sharif will only do things that would directly benefit them. Their disregard for the general population is evident when we factor in things like the Model Town incident, where innocent people were injured because of politicians trying to intimidate their opposition.

PTI may not be the panacea for Pakistan's problems and Imran Khan may not be the messiah. But at the very least, it's a little hope in the form of a new party with new ideals.

I don't oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am a blind follower of IK. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am misinformed or a 'burger'. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I want military rule. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I hate democracy.
I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I'm sick of being lied to. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am sick of listening to false promises. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because he's had enough chances. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I want a proper democracy, where leaders are actually accountable and where people's votes can be accounted for.

Sorry for the really long post but there's too much to be said.
People are welcome to discuss, dissect and criticize, just please keep it civil.

@Leader @Norwegian @Jazzbot @orangzaib @Akheilos @FaujHistorian
 
Like Imran Khan, I had no personal contempt or dislike for Nawaz Sharif. I was 11 years old when under PM Nawaz's rule Pakistan became a nuclear power, and I still remember those days of joy and glory for the entire nation after 1998 May 28's nuclear blasts! And when Musharraf initiated bloodless but popular coup against his government, I felt sorry for him and prayed for his release.
Over the years as I grew up here in Norway, I totally forgot about him thinking his exile to Jeddah was a worthy face-saving NRO deal between Musharraf and Saudis. My contempt and dislike of him started when he illegally tried to enter Pakistan on that fateful day of September the 10th 2007:
Sharif lands in Pak, is sent back to Jeddah

His NRO-deal between Musharraf and Saudis resulted in his 10 year ban from joining any political activity, yet he returned and stood in elections during Musharraf's presidency, a clear violation of a pre-agreed deal that saved his life from Martial Law Court verdict 7 years ago! And to make the matters worse, he publicly said there was NO NRO-deal between him and Musharraf until the Court released true insights from that NRO:
“I, Muhammad Nawaz Sharif, accept the help by a personality for negotiation for the release from imprisonment in Pakistan. I am satisfied with this whole process of the negotiation. In the country where I would adopt residence, there I would not take part in any business or political activity and nor would take part for ten in any politics, regarding imprisonment or against the interests of Pakistan. I will not proceed to another country without any permission of the country where I will reside for ten years outside Pakistan, and that I will come back in the same country. I will not tell anything to anybody about the personality and the country, through which the agreement has been made.”
The truth about Nawaz Sharif’s exile deal - thenews.com.pk

This was the last nail in the coffin of Nawaz Sharif and proved to me that he is clearly a lying, cunning, cheating, douchebag of a personality who's only interested in increasing his own personal wealth and power, and doesn't give a damn about people of Pakistan. His utter failure to respond IK's basic demands of vote-audit in only 4 controversial constituencies further hardened my skepticism against his illegitimate rule in Pakistan. Go Nawaz Go! You do not deserve to be a third time PM of my wonderful country!
 
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Like Imran Khan, I have no personal contempt or dislike for Nawaz Sharif. I was 11 years old when under PM Nawaz's rule Pakistan became a nuclear power, and I still remember those days of joy and glory for the entire nation after 1998 May 28's nuclear blasts! And when Musharraf initiated bloodless but popular coup against his government, I felt sorry for him and prayed for his release.
Over the years as I grew up here in Norway, I totally forgot about him thinking his exile to Jeddah was a worthy face-saving NRO deal between Musharraf and Saudis. My contempt and dislike of him started when he illegally tried to enter Pakistan on that fateful day of September the 10th 2007:
Sharif lands in Pak, is sent back to Jeddah

His NRO-deal between Musharraf and Saudis resulted in his 10 year ban from joining any political activity, yet he returned and stood in elections during Musharraf's presidency, a clear violation of a pre-agreed deal that saved his life from Martial Law Court verdict 7 years ago! And to make the matters worse, he publicly said there was NO NRO-deal between him and Musharraf until the Court released true insights from that NRO:

The truth about Nawaz Sharif’s exile deal - thenews.com.pk

This proved once and for all that Nawaz Sharif is clearly a lying, cunning, cheating, douchebag of a personality who is only interested in increasing his own wealth and power, and do not give a damn about people of Pakistan. His utter failure to respond IK's basic demands of vote-audit in only 4 controversial constituencies further hardened my skepticism against his illegitimate rule in Pakistan. Go Nawaz Go! You do not deserve to be a third time PM of my wonderful country!
Well said, thank you for covering this aspect which I did not mention in my post. :tup:
Can't cover every part of it I suppose, it'd take a whole series books if we were to try and cover each and every reason Nawaz Sharif doesn't deserve Pakistan's support.
 
Well said, thank you for covering this aspect which I did not mention in my post. :tup:
Can't cover every part of it I suppose, it'd take a whole series books if we were to try and cover each and every reason Nawaz Sharif doesn't deserve Pakistan's support.

One can sum up almost all aspects of Nawaz Sharif by watching this hilarious political song made by AXIS band titled literally as "Noora"! :D
 
I came across some interesting articles here,
Can Nawaz Sharif fix the economy? - Newspaper - DAWN.COM
PML-N’s financial wizardry - Sayem Z Ali
I'm going to be quoting specific parts of these articles here but they're both worth a complete read. This post is meant to explain my, and many, many Pakistanis' point of view, put things in a little perspective and reply to those who wonder that why, despite the apparent failure of the protests and PTI, I continue to oppose the PMLN government.

Pakistan has problems, everybody knows that. But truly understanding what these problems are is a different matter entirely. While gossip and conspiracy theories are really popular among people, the average Pakistani has a vague idea about the politics, the underlying issues behind their problems. What they do see, however, are the 'symptoms'. This makes the people, the masses, really gullible.

On the other hand, we have people who do not understand the plight of the Pakistani people yet believe that they understand the politics. People living in posh areas, or the expatriates spectating from abroad. They may wonder why, despite all the investments and mega-projects and whatnot the current PMLN government has been making, is Pakistan's situation deteriorating? They will also then wonder why people are protesting against the government, surely it is these protests and political unrest that is responsible for the deterioration? Others will be quick to blame the Army for meddling with civilian affairs and 'sabotaging democracy'.

The truth is very different. In order to actually understand the situation, we must see both of the points of view and combine them in an honest analysis.

PMLN, for example, has always made projects, policies and the like to show how much work they are doing. But anyone who has lived in Punjab, their favorite province, can tell how full of lies they are. An outsider may see the 'investments', 'economic reforms', mega projects and schemes and think that Nawaz Sharif is very good. Similarly, An average, relatively uninformed Pakistani will see things like the protests and blame them for undermining Nawaz's efforts.

The truth is that these PR projects do nothing to actually help Pakistanis. On one hand we have them handing out laptops (not to mention all the fraud in this) and on the other we have schools without books or a roof. Then we have mega projects like the Metro Bus (again, not counting the fact that NS benefits from these through his steel mills and other businesses) while Lahore doesn't have a proper sewage and drainage system. PMLN had more than enough time in Punjab to at least fix this. No developed province (or at least a city like Lahore) should flood every time it rains.



The 'prescriptions and symptoms' analogy the author is is using here is perfect when we look at Pakistani healthcare. If you go to a clinic, in most places of Pakistan, you'll find 'doctors' giving patients strong drips and injections for small things like a cough or fever. Now what this does is that it convinces poor, uneducated people that they are being given proper treatment and they happily fork out their hard-earned cash. Their symptoms stop, but after a while, thanks to the underlying issue being ignored, their symptoms return, worse than before.

That is precisely the strategy NS uses in Pakistan. Just replace 'injections and drips' with mega-projects and 'patients' with the public and you get an honest analysis of PMLN's performance.


Now over here this author makes a good point, then reverts to milking the old 'security establishment' argument. The truth is that this idea that the Army has been undermining the country is grossly exaggerated. It may have been true in the past but during Kayani's leadership and now Raheel Sharif's, this 'meddling' was talk and almost nothing else. And even when we talk about the past, most of the times it wasn't the Army that caused the downfall of civilian governments - It was the politicians' greed and incompetence that gave the Army reason and opportunity to intervene.

The point about 'on paper' is further backed by the fact that while PMLN boasted a lot about their economic success, the actual facts were stating the contrary, like this author says here:

They have some short boosts, for a couple of days it feels like everything is going well but one month or two later, everything is back to deteriorating again.

In Punjab around 2009, where PMLN ruled during the previous term, we used to hear things like 'loadshedding will finish by 2012'. In 2012, sitting in the dark and reading a newspaper with a candle, I read that the metro bus project started, all while we had no electricity for upto 18 hours a day. PMLN ruled for a long time and all they did was PR.

With the metro bus, one might argue of its importance or effect but the truth is it cost a lot more than it should have. And this cost is not counting the fact that they demolished countless shops and businesses to make room for it. I was in Lahore and I witnessed shops, bakeries and mosques being demolished. People complained about not getting proper compensation (in some cases, they didn't get any. They're probably still desperately wandering around in courts).
Surprisingly, very less media reported this.
All I found was this:
What price the Azadi | TNS - The News on Sunday
And lets not forget the long-term problems caused by the project:
Is Metro Bus a success story?
What about the cost of maintaining it and running it? What about the practicality of allocating so many resources to it while Pakistan suffers from so many other pertinent issues? It seems like PMLN has left behind a perfect trap for whoever comes in power after them - they will be blamed for the eventual deterioration and ultimately, failure, of the Metro Bus project.

At the end of the day, politicians like Nawaz Sharif will only do things that would directly benefit them. Their disregard for the general population is evident when we factor in things like the Model Town incident, where innocent people were injured because of politicians trying to intimidate their opposition.

PTI may not be the panacea for Pakistan's problems and Imran Khan may not be the messiah. But at the very least, it's a little hope in the form of a new party with new ideals.

I don't oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am a blind follower of IK. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am misinformed or a 'burger'. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I want military rule. I do not oppose Nawaz Sharif because I hate democracy.
I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I'm sick of being lied to. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I am sick of listening to false promises. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because he's had enough chances. I oppose Nawaz Sharif because I want a proper democracy, where leaders are actually accountable and where people's votes can be accounted for.

Sorry for the really long post but there's too much to be said.
People are welcome to discuss, dissect and criticize, just please keep it civil.

@Leader @Norwegian @Jazzbot @orangzaib @Akheilos @FaujHistorian




OK. Here is how youthias go.


1. Try to proof NS is inept.

2. Without voting him out in 2018, just burn down parliament.

This is how Sh. Rasheed and his sock puppet want to work.

This is how youthias and burgers want to rule.

by burning down the parliament.

and inviting army.


pathetic.
 
OK. Here is how youthias go.


1. Try to proof NS is inept.

2. Without voting him out in 2018, just burn down parliament.

This is how Sh. Rasheed and his sock puppet want to work.

This is how youthias and burgers want to rule.

by burning down the parliament.

and inviting army.


pathetic.
This is how Nooras respond to a series of well explained and researched arguments.
Pathetic.
 
This is how Nooras respond to a series of well explained and researched arguments.
Pathetic.


If someone builds up Pakistan, builds up projects in Pakistan, it is praise worthy.

If you don't like someone else's project, don't go and $hit on it.

Build your own. that you think should be of higher prriority.


OP reminds me of this Amreeka return "engineer" whom I met while traveling north on a luxury bus from Lahore.

This guy was enjoying airconditioned service, zero-bump ride, and still complaining,

Constantly whining! Why noora built this motorway.

I said! What the fork. If you hate motorway this much, why would you travel on it.

This is why I say Pakistani educated elite are down right negative like my community in Karachi.

God gives us ne-mats and blessings.

And we do shaitan's work by $hitting on all the blessings like motorway, big homes, nice cars, and plenty of food.

Are these things expensive. Fork Yeah.

Can many of us educated elite afford them. Fork yeah

But still we go around like little cry babies.

What do they say "Ro ro Imran Ro" should be "Ro Ro Pakistani educated elite ro".

Just pathetic to be so na-shukra.
 
If someone builds up Pakistan, builds up projects in Pakistan, it is praise worthy.
If you don't like someone else's project, don't go and $hit on it.
Build your own. that you think should be of higher prriority.
Irrelevant argument. If someone wastes money in Pakistan while children are starving to death, it is not praiseworthy at all.


OP reminds me of this Amreeka return "engineer" whom I met while traveling north on a luxury bus from Lahore.
This guy was enjoying airconditioned service, zero-bump ride, and still complaining,
Why noora built this motorway.
What the fork. If you hate motorway this much, why would you travel on it.
This is why I say Pakistani educated elite are down right negative like my community in Karachi.
God gives us ne-mats and blessings.
And we do shaitan's work by $hitting on all the blessings like motorway, big homes, nice cars, and plenty of food.
Are these things expensive. Fork Yeah.
Can many of us educated elite afford them. Fork yeah
But still we go around like little cry babies.
What do they say "Ro ro Imran Ro" should be "Ro Ro Pakistani educated elite ro".
Just pathetic to be so na-shukra.
You are representing everything that is wrong with Pakistanis. Just because YOU can afford big homes and nice cars doesn't mean you don't give half a shi*t to those who can't. And a few metro buses and motorways are enough to make you forget about the murder of 14 people, election fraud and all your democratic rights? Seriously?

It is absolutely retarded to answer 'the elections were rigged, we should investigate it so that it doesn't happen again' with 'bla bla metro buses and motorways', which is exactly what you are doing. And what about all the facts i gave you about the damages caused by these kinds of projects? Don't they matter? Doesn't any of that matter?

Aur yeh jo aap apne parhe-likhe logon ko rulaney ke chakron me lagay rahte hein, aise hi mulk tabah o barbadh hota hai. Innhi logon ki wajah se aap ke paas atam bumb hai aur inhi logon ki wajah se Pakistan abhi tak is dunya ke nakshay par maujood hai. Warnah to aap ke Maharaja Nawaz Sharif ne iss ke tukray amreeka ko bech ke Saudia betha hona tha.
 
If someone builds up Pakistan, builds up projects in Pakistan, it is praise worthy.

If you don't like someone else's project, don't go and $hit on it.

Build your own. that you think should be of higher prriority.


OP reminds me of this Amreeka return "engineer" whom I met while traveling north on a luxury bus from Lahore.

This guy was enjoying airconditioned service, zero-bump ride, and still complaining,

Constantly whining! Why noora built this motorway.

I said! What the fork. If you hate motorway this much, why would you travel on it.

This is why I say Pakistani educated elite are down right negative like my community in Karachi.

God gives us ne-mats and blessings.

And we do shaitan's work by $hitting on all the blessings like motorway, big homes, nice cars, and plenty of food.

Are these things expensive. Fork Yeah.

Can many of us educated elite afford them. Fork yeah

But still we go around like little cry babies.

What do they say "Ro ro Imran Ro" should be "Ro Ro Pakistani educated elite ro".

Just pathetic to be so na-shukra.

Fork yeah? That's implied meaning is a swear word, which can get your banned. So mind your language.
 
Irrelevant argument. If someone wastes money in Pakistan while children are starving to death, it is not praiseworthy at all.



You are representing everything that is wrong with Pakistanis. Just because YOU can afford big homes and nice cars doesn't mean you don't give half a shi*t to those who can't. And a few metro buses and motorways are enough to make you forget about the murder of 14 people, election fraud and all your democratic rights? Seriously?

It is absolutely retarded to answer 'the elections were rigged, we should investigate it so that it doesn't happen again' with 'bla bla metro buses and motorways', which is exactly what you are doing. And what about all the facts i gave you about the damages caused by these kinds of projects? Don't they matter? Doesn't any of that matter?

Aur yeh jo aap apne parhe-likhe logon ko rulaney ke chakron me lagay rahte hein, aise hi mulk tabah o barbadh hota hai. Innhi logon ki wajah se aap ke paas atam bumb hai aur inhi logon ki wajah se Pakistan abhi tak is dunya ke nakshay par maujood hai. Warnah to aap ke Maharaja Nawaz Sharif ne iss ke tukray amreeka ko bech ke Saudia betha hona tha.
Children die all over the world.

But only a few politicize the issue.
 
Without voting him out in 2018, just burn down parliament.
And how exactly do you suggest we do that without reforming entire election system? :D

This is how Nooras respond to a series of well explained and researched arguments.
He is not Noora, just pro-government. He would have supported any party in government and criticized anyone in opposition :D

If someone builds up Pakistan, builds up projects in Pakistan, it is praise worthy.
Depends on the kind of building. Starving, jobless, fuelless, illiterate and sick masses of people DO NOT need billions of dollar worth of Metro Bus and Motorway projects all over the country! Priority of any goodwill government should be investing in its own people's well being first. But you have probably figured out there is not much advertisement, kickbacks and commissions to gain by doing that :D

Constantly whining! Why noora built this motorway.
When Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif conceived Motor Way in his first term(1990–1993) and later inaugurated in 1997, Pakistan was relatively stable in terms of economy and energy production. It was BEFORE Pakistan demonstrated its nuclear capability and thus came under international sanctions regime, leading to permanent economic downturn and chronic energy shortages throughout the country. It makes no sense investing so much in roads and bridges today while majority of Pakistanis are suffering through gigantic inflation, regular blackouts, gas cuts, starvation, flooding, unemployment and various diseases and sicknesses.

Children die all over the world.
If children were dying in Canada, the way they do in Pakistan due to government's gross incompetence and negligence, nothing would happen to your sitting government?

But only a few politicize the issue.
Also in Canada?
 
Yes, yes, now I'm 'politicizing' it. Screw the rest of my long, logical and factual argument because I dared acknowledge the fact that PMLN's projects are a waste of money.
Indeed motorway is waste of money, it's far empty than a barren desert. Indeed metro bus is a waste of money, because no one rides it. Indeed the free laptops are waste of money, they don't turn on, they're mere show pieces.
 
Irrelevant argument. If someone wastes money in Pakistan while children are starving to death, it is not praiseworthy at all.

Children are starving in Thar.

While Sindh Gov sleeps.


Children are hit by polio in Bannu

While KP gov dances in the moonlight

Both these gov have enough funds and food to feed the starving children and vaccinate them.

Now tell me which bridge you wanna blow
that will ease your hate against development.

Which bridge in Lahore

That will quench your thirst?

please
 

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