Should Pakistan give up on Afghanistan?

[M8R]

I think we should let india do whatever the hell it wants to do there - We should get out all our assets out of Afghanistan and block all links with Afghanistan - Cut it virtually from Pakistan - It's not worth the investment - We should instead strengthen our internal security.I just can't understand why we have to counter India there - Afghanistan is a stone age country what is there?Nothing - Instead we should improve our relations with India and that is the best solution and then concentrate on our economy.Fighting proxy wars will hamper our economy.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I think we should let india do whatever the hell it wants to do there - We should get out all our assets out of Afghanistan and block all links with Afghanistan - Cut it virtually from Pakistan - It's not worth the investment - We should instead strengthen our internal security.I just can't understand why we have to counter India there - Afghanistan is a stone age country what is there?Nothing - Instead we should improve our relations with India and that is the best solution and then concentrate on our economy.Fighting proxy wars will hamper our economy.

With an upfront acceptance by Afghanistan of the Durand as an international border, and assurances on not allowing India to foment insurgencies in Pakistan from Afghan soil, I see no reason why we need to be bothered with Afghanistan.

But can the GoA give such assurances and have the Afghan Parliament ratify them, especially the one related to accepting Pakistan's sovereignty and borders?

 

[Dr.Evil]

With an upfront acceptance by Afghanistan of the Durand as an international border, and assurances on not allowing India to foment insurgencies in Pakistan from Afghan soil, I see no reason why we need to be bothered with Afghanistan.

But can the GoA give such assurances and have the Afghan Parliament ratify them, especially the one related to accepting Pakistan's sovereignty and borders?

In the same tune can GOP and Pak Army give assurances that it will not meddle in the affairs of Afghanistan directly or through their proxies ?

As far as the borders are concerned both the countries have to come to a negotiated settlement.

 

[BATMAN]

Fighting proxy wars will hamper our economy.

Every penny what india earns has a share in planning terrorism in Pakistan or build nagative propaganda on media or on diplomatic level or spreading corruption in Pakistan etc.
We cannot separate our geography from us.
Don't be misguided that all living in Pakistan are Pakistanis.. thousands of them are embeded moles with different task.... like running criminal gangs.... some are disguised as fanatic mullahs, some are in judiciary and some are in political parties etc.
If we don't fight back india will bleed us to the point that we will loose all values and even our religon for the sake of our survival.

It is up to us to reach that point where we start to care more for our survival rather than Pakistan or any thing else or push back this fourth generation war waged upon us.

We should never forget that our enemy have no values they believe in deception. So let me ask... where your mind would set the limits for an unbeliever?

I bet, in present circumstances Pakistan society cannot survive even two more years.
Every day we hear trucks of explosives being recovered .....by chance!!! to me it only tells over whelming presence.
Where as govt. never officialy disclose the origin of those wepons.. every day terrorists are being captured in major cities .......by chance.... so it also tells me of their over whelming presence!

War is in our back yard not in Afghanistan.... our enemy knew one day we might block Afghan border same way as we did with indians and they also knew next govt. will stop all transit activity so they havce to be stupid for not capatalizing the fortune moment.
Now on we will be fighting war in our streets.... we should be thankful that efforts of ethnic war and tribal war has failed... all thanks ot the society which is largely liberal and not fanatic.
For comming years our society will remain hijacked by those mobs of RAW operatives who go out and burn markets and trains.
What next ???
Govt. has accelerated target killing upon strict advise of RAW... .no pro Pakistani will be in peace from npow onwards he or she will be rounded up one way or the other.
I think if govt. succeed in terrorising the society and civil administration with few hundred target killing than no one will ever speak against them and they will rig next elections and will impose them as rulers once again.
May Allah save us all from this state sponsored target killing headed by Rehman Malik.

 

[Old School]

May Allah save us all from this state sponsored target killing headed by Rehman Malik.

This one is very funny. I cant stop laughing. Rehman Malik who is not even welcome at GHQ and he is ordering state sponsored target killing ? This is not credible.

 

[T-Faz]

In the same tune can GOP and Pak Army give assurances that it will not meddle in the affairs of Afghanistan directly or through their proxies ?

As far as the borders are concerned both the countries have to come to a negotiated settlement.

If you cared to learn your history, you would notice that Daud invaded Pakistan to reunite Pashtunistan. Our own Pashtuns fought them off.

We do not want to meddle in their affairs but when they they intentionally utilise their Durand Line issue, we have to give them a fitting reply.

I am all for severing ties with Afghanistan, complete cut off of relations and borders being fenced. We did the later but were stopped from completing it.

Indians would love what happens to them. Did you happen to read the comments of an Afghani who registered here recently. That would be a sight to see.

 

[M8R]

Dr.Evil It is Afghanistan not Pakistan which does not recognize Pakistan's border as such they're unofficially declaring Pakistan's their enemy by not recognizing our territory.Also we have millions of Afghans in our country so we can meddle in their affairs just as you did in East Pakistan so long as they don't accept Durand line as border and don't respect Pakistan's Sovereign Territory.

 

[karan.1970]

@Batman, of all the delusional, misguided rants I have seen on this forum, you beat them all by light years. I dont know whether to respond back to you or share the embarrasment of some of the saner members who have read this before me.

I think I will stay with the second option

 

[Dr.Evil]

If you cared to learn your history, you would notice that Daud invaded Pakistan to reunite Pashtunistan. Our own Pashtuns fought them off.

We do not want to meddle in their affairs but when they they intentionally utilise their Durand Line issue, we have to give them a fitting reply.

I am all for severing ties with Afghanistan, complete cut off of relations and borders being fenced. We did the later but were stopped from completing it.

Indians would love what happens to them. Did you happen to read the comments of an Afghani who registered here recently. That would be a sight to see.

There will always be disputes over boundaries unless both the countries come to a negotiated settlement. ( Aghan - Pak , India -Pak , China - India )

As far as meddling is concerned - Pak has trained , Armed and Housed the barbarin Taliban on pak soil.

 

[T-Faz]

Here is a brief history of the aggressive stance of Afghanistan that hurt them in the long run.

In 1961, as a result of Daoud's antagonistic policies and support to militias in areas along the Durand Line, Pakistan closed its borders with Afghanistan causing an economic crisis and greater dependence on the USSR. The USSR became Afghanistan's principal trading partner. Within a few months, the USSR had sent jet airplanes, tanks, heavy and light artillery for a heavily discounted price tag of $25 million.

In 1962, Daud sent troops across the international border into the Bajaur region of Pakistan in an attempt to manipulate events in that area and to press the Pashtunistan issue, but the Afghan military forces were routed by local Pashtun tribesmen, along with the Pakistani military. During this period the propaganda war from Afghanistan, carried on by radio, was relentless.

 

[T-Faz]

There will always be disputes over boundaries unless both the countries come to a negotiated settlement. ( Aghan - Pak , India -Pak , China - India )

As fas is meddling is concerned - Pak has trained , Armed and Housed the barbarin Taliban on pak soil.

We were able to resolve our issues with China amicably where both reworked the boundaries but I guess the some countries do not want the same to occur.

My incident precedes yours and we never trained the Taliban, as for arming, USA also armed the Taliban and the Taliban is also housed in many other countries where they are currently participating in dialogue. Why do they not pick them up from Dubai, Malta or wherever else they are currently negotiating.

 

[M8R]

Negotiating about Durand Line is like Negotiation with India for Indian Punjab Border.It is not UN recognized disputed border.Would India like if Bangladesh tomorrow starts to claim Indian West Bengal as Bangladeshi Bengal.

 

[Dr.Evil]

We were able to resolve our issues with China amicably where both reworked the boundaries but I guess the some countries do not want the same to occur.

My incident precedes yours and we never trained the Taliban, as for arming, USA also armed the Taliban and the Taliban is also housed in many other countries where they are currently participating in dialogue. Why do they not pick them up from Dubai, Malta or wherever else they are currently negotiating.

If you can come to a negotiated settlement with china ( Aksai Chin Area is part of J & K which was under the illegal occupation
of pak and given away to china - that's another thread anyway).
You have to come to a negotiated settlement with Afghanistan and India aswell, that's the only way.

Pakistan's Ex-ISI chief would not agree to that statement and he so proudly goes around the media claiming to be be their mentors and Friends.

Another ISI agent who was killed recently, was also a trainer to the taliban.

 

[Dr.Evil]

Negotiating about Durand Line is like Negotiation with India for Indian Punjab Border.It is not UN recognized disputed border.Would India like if Bangladesh tomorrow starts to claim Indian West Bengal as Bangladeshi Bengal.

Its not so simple as that - There was never any agreement on the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan to accept durand line as international border.

 

[Old School]

There are many factors involved in relation to Afghanistan. Not just the Durand line. It will be over simplification to say that Durand line is the decisive factor vis a vis Afghanistan. In fact , Durand line is the least important factor. Redrawing an established international border is no longer internationally entertained. Afghanistan will be internationally isolated if they press ahead with the Durand line.
The key issue is the 'Strategic depth ' doctrine of the Pakistan's defence policy. We haven't had a re-evaluation on this issue since 1976 due to other pre-occupation. We have to work on this defence policy. I believe that the relation with India is interlinked with relation with Afghanistan. We need to fight the radicals at home, work on India affairs and consolidate civil institutions before Afghan issue can be resolved.