Turkey nixes Israel’s ‘US-like regret’ offer

[LegionnairE]

They are bloody amateurs but not idiots, that boat didn't pose a threat to anyone killing was pure intentional. A kid, and also a US citizen was shot to death with a headshot from short distance and our king solomon here has no problem with it.

I'm beginning to think diaspora Jews are like diaspora Armenians. Insecure and Unreasonable. If everybody just stayed in their home country world would be a better place.

Excuse me, I'm really tired of hot heads and fanatics.

 

[Solomon2]

They are bloody amateurs but not idiots, that boat didn't pose a threat to anyone killing was pure intentional.

"Intentional" only in that the Israelis used deadly force when they were attacked with the intent to maim, torture, and kill.

Which is why Israel will not apologize; no one apologizes for justly defending themselves from such an attack. That's also why YOU should support the Israelis, so in the future somebody doesn't try to take these rights away from you.

Excuse me, I'm really tired of hot heads and fanatics.

I consider myself rather reasonable and cool-headed regarding Israel. But I am a fanatic about banana peppers!

 

[Solomon2]

...you deliberately distort the facts and make up weird scenarios that fit to your ideological thinking about the region.

You can't point to a single fact I'm distorting, can you? Instead, I correct distortions. Which should make you wonder exactly how "weird" my scenarios are. I'm the Zionist who five years ago stood by the Egyptians to demonstrate outside the Egyptian embassy, denouncing Mubarak and calling for his ouster. What better indication could you have that I might, just might, have a useful insight that citizens and subjects of the region don't?

 

[Twain]

"Intentional" only in that the Israelis used deadly force when they were attacked with the intent to maim, torture, and kill.

Which is why Israel will not apologize; no one apologizes for justly defending themselves from such an attack. That's also why YOU should support the Israelis, so in the future somebody doesn't try to take these rights away from you.

I consider myself rather reasonable and cool-headed regarding Israel. But I am a fanatic about banana peppers!

This was a pretty dumb move by both sides. One one hand, Turkey allows the ship to sail in the first place, a direct provocation toward Israel and despite the Zero problems with our neighbors pledge.

Then you have Israel over reacting, yet again, attacking a ship in international waters and using excessive force. There were much better ways to deal with this, Israel just chose to not show any restraint. In the end, Israel may have won the battle but lost the war.

Israel to ease Gaza blockade

 

[Solomon2]

Then you have Israel over reacting, yet again, attacking a ship in international waters and using excessive force.

Factually incorrect. There is plenty of photo, video, and radio evidence to back up the Israeli version of events.

If you are relying on the U.N.-sponsored Goldstone Report for "facts" it is well to recall that (1) its explicit charge was not to find out the truth, but to come up with Israeli "crimes" and (2) Mr. Goldstone himself repudiated the report.

If you rely on the Guardian for facts then your mind is really messed up; its reporters know they are distorting and just don't care. I suggest you try covering events you know are being covered by the media and discover for yourself the difference - sure was an eye-opener for me.

A whole day and the Turks here have come up empty. Time to reconsider, yes? Was it for nothing that Turkey had good relations with the Jews of Palestine for eighty-plus years, from the Treaty of Sevres to the election of Erdogan? Maybe, for the sake of your nation's safety and sanity, it's time to side with the Jews of Israel once more?

 

[Cerian]

You can't point to a single fact I'm distorting, can you? Instead, I correct distortions.

Israel attacked the boat in international waters

Your facts are incorrect.

Pointing on distortion of a fact done by you. Thanks.

 

[cyphercide]

My comment to the above is that; Israel should remember that the US is the only super power in the world and Pakistan receives cash from the US, so in a way there is very limited option for how the US can apologize. Israel should not compare itself with the US.

Nicely done. Is one to deduce that Pakistan is a cash hoe to be receiving apologies of the kind that Turkey can't accept ?

 

[Twain]

Factually incorrect. There is plenty of photo, video, and radio evidence to back up the Israeli version of events.

If you are relying on the U.N.-sponsored Goldstone Report for "facts" it is well to recall that (1) its explicit charge was not to find out the truth, but to come up with Israeli "crimes" and (2) Mr. Goldstone himself repudiated the report.

If you rely on the Guardian for facts then your mind is really messed up; its reporters know they are distorting and just don't care. I suggest you try covering events you know are being covered by the media and discover for yourself the difference - sure was an eye-opener for me.

A whole day and the Turks here have come up empty. Time to reconsider, yes? Was it for nothing that Turkey had good relations with the Jews of Palestine for eighty-plus years, from the Treaty of Sevres to the election of Erdogan? Maybe, for the sake of your nation's safety and sanity, it's time to side with the Jews of Israel once more?

I'm not relying on any one report and I haven't read the Goldstone report. I may have read the Guardian article. I have read several reports of the incident and made my conclusions based on reports from many different points of view.

I stand by my statement that Israel over-reacted again and handled this about as poorly as they possibly could. There were many other alternatives by both sides that could have prevented this mess. Everyone involved instead chose the most controversial and provocative actions they possibly could have chosen. The peace flotilla wanted a conflict and Israel was dumb enough to give it to them.

 

[Saithan]

Well, thanks for all the inputs. What I was more interested in was whether the news was correct. Did liebermann say something like "if a statement like the one US gave to Pakistan is acceptable, then we'll give one". That's just it going back to discussing why, who and what is pointless as we've all got our POV on what conduct you can do in international waters.

Under the pretense/accusation of "potential terrorist" you can pretty much do anything to anyone.

Too bad it is a fact Israelies jammed and confiscated all video recordings from the civilians.

 

[LegionnairE]

A whole day and the Turks here have come up empty. Time to reconsider, yes? Was it for nothing that Turkey had good relations with the Jews of Palestine for eighty-plus years, from the Treaty of Sevres to the election of Erdogan? Maybe, for the sake of your nation's safety and sanity, it's time to side with the Jews of Israel once more?

safety? and sanity? Let's make it clear once again, we've been here since 1071 and neither catholics nor the 'mighty' british empire could've done anything about it. We'll be here long after state of Israel bites the dust. You can be absolutely sure about it.

You just don't get it. We have no quarrels with jews. Probably one of few nations that don't have these old grudges against us. Ask any Turk you'll get the same response. How many people you think actually gave a crap about erdogan's show off at davos? only a few extremist zealots.

Israel brought this on herself.

 

[PteX]

safety? and sanity? Let's make it clear once again, we've been here since 1071 and neither catholics nor the 'mighty' british empire could've done anything about it. We'll be here long after state of Israel bites the dust. You can be absolutely sure about it.

You just don't get it. We have no quarrels with jews. Probably one of few nations that don't have these old grudges against us. Ask any Turk you'll get the same response. How many people you think actually gave a crap about erdogan's show off at davos? only a few extremist zealots.

Israel brought this on herself.

Exactly, Turkey brought this on herself. Reelecting an Islamist government is what brought the current crisis in Turkish-Israeli relations and exactly what brought the woes of Turkey today. From the problems with Israel to the problems with Syria and the Kurds.

 

[TurAr]

Exactly, Turkey brought this on herself. Reelecting an Islamist government is what brought the current crisis in Turkish-Israeli relations and exactly what brought the woes of Turkey today. From the problems with Israel to the problems with Syria and the Kurds.

Indeed the Islamic government of Turkey made a bad impact on Turkish-Israeli relations but apparently your government have thought that maybe if they kill 9 Turkish citizens it would make things better

Seriously, AKP is not the only one to be blamed. i don't want to argue about flotilla again. Just wanted to say my opinion.

 

[PteX]

Indeed the Islamic government of Turkey made a bad impact on Turkish-Israeli relations but apparently your government have thought that maybe if they kill 9 Turkish citizens it would make things better

Seriously, AKP is not the only one to be blamed. i don't want to argue about flotilla again. Just wanted to say my opinion.

It is true that my government is also at fault, i agree. They took the bait the Islamists threw at them and added fuel to the fire.

 

[TurAr]

It is true that my government is also at fault, i agree. They took the bait the Islamists threw at them and added fuel to the fire.

I found a nice article about the issue: OPINION - Offending the Turks
Note that it has written before the Mavi Marmara incident.

You see, folatilla was not the first mistake of Israel's government. Nevertheless, i've probably discussed these incidents and Turkish-Israeli relations with dozens of Israelis. You are the first one who accepted your government's wrongdoings.

By the way, the last paragraph in the article is quite ironic isn't it.

 

[PteX]

I found a nice article about the issue: OPINION - Offending the Turks
Note that it has written before the Mavi Marmara incident.

You see, folatilla was not the first mistake of Israel's government. Nevertheless, i've probably discussed these incidents and Turkish-Israeli relations with dozens of Israelis. You are the first one who accepted your government's wrongdoings.

By the way, the last paragraph in the article is quite ironic isn't it.

Yeah. That event with the Turkish Ambassador is exactly what i was talking about.
This event with the ambassador was after very anti-Israel rhetoric by the PM of Turkey and Turkish TV shows depicting Israelis as monsters.

"To save its ties with Turkey, Israel needs to implement a strategy that tackles the AKP’s anti-Israeli policies and rhetoric without simultaneously offending the Turks."

This is what should have been done, instead of giving AKP exactly what they wanted.