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We ‘culturally dominated’ China for over 2,000 years: Rajnath

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He was laughing at the exact verbatim used by the Minister that was originally quoted by Hu Shih. If he laughs at only one, he is a hypocrite.

As for the nuances of what the culture is today in any part of the world, that is a debate for another thread. The whole point is Buddhism played a huge role in Chinese history for 2000 years, and Buddhism is undeniably from India. Trying to poke political holes in what the definition of India is now and what it was at the time of Buddha opens up a can of worms that will backfire on you and anyone else.



Good that you can convince yourself and shut your ears and eyes to the response. Don't expect any meaningful debate or engagement....since you are just a troll then.



Since language means so much to you as proof of countryhood, you're telling me if I go to Nepal and speak to them in Hindi they wont understand me?

Have you listened to the Mantras that Buddhist monks chant in China and Japan? What language are they in?

The Buddha was from Nepal. Everyone knows this.

And Nepal was never a part of India, or even British India.

You can argue as much as you like, this is just a historical fact. :wave:

In fact Hinduism originated from outside of India's own borders, in modern day Pakistan, the site of the Indus Valley Civilization, which came from Iranians before that.
 
First become someone who matters and then we will consider it.

Long back had stumbled upon this site...has some interesting things to read about.

http://www.hinduwisdom.info/index.htm

http://www.hinduwisdom.info/India_and_China.htm


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Chinese version of Brahma

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Japanese goddess 'Benzaiten' (Saraswati in india)

"Benzaiten (, ) is a Japanese Buddhist goddess, who originated from the Hindu goddess Saraswati.[1] Worship of Benzaiten arrived in Japan during the 6th through 8th centuries, mainly via the Chinese translations of the Sutra of Golden Light, which has a section devoted to her. She is also mentioned in the Lotus Sutra and often depicted holding a biwa, a traditional Japanese lute, just as Saraswati holds a veena. Benzaiten is a syncretic entity with both a Buddhist and a Shintoside."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzaiten
 
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Good that you can convince yourself and shut your ears and eyes to the response. Don't expect any meaningful debate or engagement....since you are just a troll then.

What debate is need? , my statement is as valid as what who ever said that bullshi1, why do I need to become someone matter to support my claim? LMAO China was never been dominated by India culturally, I have seen nothing Indian in our culture beside some curry that I get from store.
 
He was laughing at the exact verbatim used by the Minister that was originally quoted by Hu Shih. If he laughs at only one, he is a hypocrite.
Hehe, not he hypocrite, but you are hypocrite, I don't discuss with you on whether the sentence is right, but you minister here quote this is very ridiculous, just can delude you inidan, from you comments, I think you are satisfied by your minister and the sentence.

If talking about the sentence quoted, tell me how much Chinese aggree with it? I have said, Hu is just a Chinese normal literati, you believe every Chinese literati and what they said?


As for the nuances of what the culture is today in any part of the world, that is a debate for another thread. The whole point is Buddhism played a huge role in Chinese history for 2000 years, and Buddhism is undeniably from India. Trying to poke political holes in what the definition of India is now and what it was at the time of Buddha opens up a can of worms that will backfire on you and anyone else.
Play huge role? how huge? do you know what's the host culture of China Culture? if buddhism is not host culture of China culture, how could it dominate Chinese? is it a joke, I have said there are influence on China, but dominating, it is exaggerated, just can delude yourself.

Do you curse us because we don't aggree with you? hehe, Buddism merciful, you don't know that? and tell me, how many Chinese are atheist? it is not we try to poke political holes in, but you try, you minister should attend to his own work, but, I don't think you indian can elect right leader and officials.
 
In fact Hinduism originated from outside of India's own borders, in modern day Pakistan, the site of the Indus Valley Civilization, which came from Iranians before that.


It's a lot more complex than you mention. In the same light, Iranian religion has also come from that starting point outside Iran. But look at Iranian and Indian civilization, they are as different to each other as is Chinese/Sinosphere.
 
The Buddha was from Nepal. Everyone knows this.

And Nepal was never a part of India, or even British India.

You can argue as much as you like, this is just a historical fact. :wave:

In fact Hinduism originated from outside of India's own borders, in modern day Pakistan, the site of the Indus Valley Civilization, which came from Iranians before that.

A historical fact stated by who? Some Chinese guy? Since when is history written by some Chinese troll...and is it really worth any effort in convincing him he is wrong?

Even going along with this ridiculous assertion that Nepal was never part of India (and that thus Buddhism is Nepalese and totally not Indian), The Buddha himself said it was not his birthplace that matters but where he attained enlightenment. Do you know where that place is since you are so fond of modern day locations? Or just another thing you will ignore or distort in your vain desperate effort.

You must be so angry when pretty much anyone says Buddhism is from India. Good I am glad it causes you to be so.

And do you think human beings orginated in China or something? That China was completely insulated from outside cultures except for the great Nepalese export of Buddhism :D. Chinese culture, language and roots all do not come from China either.....but eventually trace their roots to Africa. So I guess nothing comes from China as well if we are to go by your strict historical definitions.

well said man, this is pretty hilarious from Indian official (Rajnath Singh) to quote a man that is not represent China but because what he said please Indians, I'm pretty sure that this Indian official don't even what "dominated" mean beside been dominated.

Thanks for admitting that ROC is not part of China. Please tell your govt to drop the claim.
 
Nepali, Indian whatever, culturally they were variations of Indo-Gangetic civ. India, though many kingdoms, were culturally in one cultural sphere of sorts.

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Above would've been prince Siddaratha's reality. It's undeniable which civilization he would have been a part of.

And it's also undeniable which civilization seeps through where ever Buddhism and Hinduism goes.
 
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some interesting quotes:

"India sent missionaries, China sending back pilgrims. It is a striking fact that in all relations between the two civilizations, the Chinese were always the recipient and the Indian the donor." "Indian influence prevailed over the Chinese, and for evident reasons: an undoubted cultural superiority owing to much greater philosophic and religious insight, and also to a far more flexible script."

(source: The Soul of India – by Amaury de Riencourt p 141 and 161)

"The contact with poets, forest saints and the best wits of the land, the glimpse into the first awakening of Ancient India's mind as it searched, at times childishly and naively, at times with a deep intuition, but at all times earnestly and passionately, for the spiritual truths and the meaning of existence - this experience must be highly stimulating to anyone, particularly because the Hindu culture is so different and therefore so much to offer." Not until we see the richness of the Hindu mind and its essential spirituality can we understand India...."

"India was China's teacher in religion and imaginative literature, and the world's teacher in trignometry, quandratic equations, grammar, phonetics, Arabian Nights, animal fables, chess, as well as in philosophy, and that she inspired Boccaccio, Goethe, Herder, Schopenhauer, Emerson, and probably also old Aesop."

(source: The Wisdom of China and India - By Lin Yutang p. 3-4).

Henry Rudolph Davies (1865 - ) says that Besides Buddhism, Shaivism was also popular in Yunan as is manifest from the prevalence of the cult of Mahakala there. This ancient Indian colony in the south of China was the cradle of Sino-Indian cultural relationship for a long time.


It was an important outpost of Indian cultural expansion along the eastern land-routes, which Colonel Gerolamo Emilio Gerini (1860 -1913) author ofResearches on Ptolemy's geography of eastern Asia (further India and Indo-Malay archipelago p. 122 -124has described as follows:

“During the three or four centuries, preceding the Christian era, we find Indu (Hindu) dynasties established by adventurers, claiming descent from the Kshatriya potentates of northern India, ruling in upper Burma, in Siam and Laos, in Yunnan and Tonkin, and even in most parts of southeastern China. From the Brahmaputra and Manipur to the Tonkin Gulf we can trace a continuous string of petty states, ruled by those scion of the Kshatriya race, using the Sanskrit or Pali language in official documents or inscriptions; building temples and other monuments after the Indu (Hindu) style and employing Brahmana priests for the propitiatory ceremonies, connected with the court and state. Among such Indu (Hindu) monarchies (Theinni) in Burma, of Muang Hang, C’hieng Rung, Muang Khwan and Dasarna (Luang P’hrah Bang) in the Lau country; and of Agranagara (Hanoi) and Campa in Tonkin and Annan.”

“The names of peoples and cities, recorded by Ptolemy in that region, however few and imperfectly preserved, are sufficiently significant to prove the presence of the Indu (Hindu) ruling and civilizing element in these countries, undoubtedly not so barbarous as the Chinese would make them appear.”

“It is evident through the medium of those barbarians that China received part of her civilization through India.”

Among these colonies Tagong and upper Pugan were called Mayura; Prome was Sriksetra; Sen-wi (Theinni) was Sivirastra; Muang Hang, Chieng Rung and Muang Khwan were the three divisions of Ching Rung kingdom, which the prince of Yong, named Sunandakumara, united under Mahiyagananagara; Luang P’hrah Bang was Dasarna; Hanoi was Agranagara; Tagaung was Brahmadesa (P’o-;o-men), where a Sanskrit inscription, dated in Gupta era 108 – 426 A.D. refers to Hastinapura, situated in that country; and, of course, Yunana was Purvavideha or Gandhara. Thus, from Arakan, where the Mrohaung inscriptions attest the efflorescence of Indian culture, language and literature, to Yunnan, whose history we have traced above, Indian culture made a triumphant advance in ancient times.

(source: Yün-nan; the link between India and the Yangtze – by Henry Rudolph Davies Cambridge University press 1909 an India and The World - By Buddha Prakash p. 141-150).

China, like Southeast Asia too, was colonized to some extent by the ancient Hindus. The religion and culture of China are undoubtedly of Hindu origin. According to the Hindu theory of emigration, Kshatriyas from India went and established colonies in China. India was known as T'ien-chuto the Chinese.

Colonel James Tod (1782-1835) author of Annals and Antiquities of Rajasthan: or the Central and Western Rajput States of India has written:

"The genealogies of China and Tartary declare themselves to be the descendents of "Awar," son of the Hindu King "Pururawa."

According to the traditions noted in the Schuking, the ancestors of the Chinese, conducted by Fohe, come to the plains of China 2,900 years before Christ, from the high mountains Land which lies to the west of that country. This shows that the settlers into China were originally inhabitants of Kashmir, Ladakh, Little Tibet and the Punjab, which were parts of Ancient India.

Kakuzo Okakura, speaking of the missionary activity of Indian Buddhists in China, says that at one time in the single province of Lo-yang there were more than 3,000 Indian monks and 10,000 Indian families to impress their national religion and art on Chinese soil.

(source: The Ideals of the East With Special Reference to the Art of Japan - By Kakuzo Okakura p. 113).

Court Bjornstjerna (1779-1847) author of The Theogony of the Hindoos with their systems of Philosophy and Cosmogony says: " what may be said with certainty is that the religion of China came from India."


Chinese authors, too, according to Mountstuart Elphinstone (1779-1859) noted, Indian ambassadors to the court of China.

The Mahabharata refers to China several times, including a reference to presents brought by the Chinese at the Rajasuya Yajna of the Pandavas; also, the Arthasastra and the Manusmriti mention China.

According to Rene Grousset (1885-1952) French art historianin his book Rise and Splendour of Chinese Empire ASIN 0520005252 p. 79:

"the name China comes from "an ancient" Sanskrit name for the regions to the east, and not, as often supposed, from the name of the state of Ch'in," the first dynasty established by Shih Huang Ti in 221 B.C.


The Sanskrit name Cina for China could have been derived from the small state of that name in Chan-si in the northwest of China, which flourished in the fourth century B.C. Scholars have pointed out that the Chinese word for lion, shih, used long before the Chin dynasty, was derived from the Sanskrit word, simha, and that the Greek word for China, Tzinista, used by some later writers, appears to be derivative of the Sanskrit Chinasthana. The Chinese literature of the third century is full of geographic and mythological elements derived from India.

" I see no reason to doubt," comments Arthur Waley in his book, The Way and its Power, "that the 'holy mountain-men' (sheng-hsien) described by Lieh Tzu are Indian rishi; and when we read in Chuang Tzu of certain Taoists who practiced movements very similar to the asanas of Hindu yoga, it is at least a possibility that some knowledge of the yoga technique which these rishi used had also drifted into China."

Both Sir L. Wooley and British historian Arnold Toynbee speak of an earlier ready-made culture coming to China. They were right. That was the Vedic Hindu culture from India with its Sanskrit language and sacred scripts. The contemporary astronomical expertise of the Chinese, as evidenced by their records of eclipses; the philosophy of the Chinese their statecraft, all point to a Vedic origin. That is why from the earliest times we find Chinese travelers visiting India very often to renew their educational and spiritual links.

Author Kenneth Ch'en has said:

"Neo-Confucianism was stimulated in its development by a number of Buddhist ideas. Certain features of Taoism, such as its canon and pantheon, was taken over from Buddhism. Works and phrases in the Chinese language owe their origin to terms introduced by Buddhism. Chinese language owe their origin to terms introduced by Buddhism, while in astronomical, calendrical, and medical studies the Chinese benefited from information introduced by Indian Buddhist monks. Finally, and most important of all, the religious life of the Chinese was affected profoundly by the doctrines and practices, pantheon and ceremonies brought in by the Indian religion."

(source: Buddhism in China - By Kenneth Ch'en ISBN 0691000158 p. 3).

How China was part of the Indian Vedic empire is explained by Professor G. Phillips on page 585 in the 1965 edition of the Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society. He remarks,

"The maritime intercourse of India and China dates from a much earlier period, from about 680 B.C. when the sea traders of the Indian Ocean whose chiefs were Hindus founded a colony called Lang-ga, after the Indian named Lanka of Ceylon, about the present gulf of Kias-Tehoa, where they arrived in vessels having prows shaped like the heads of birds or animals after the pattern specified in the Yukti Kalpataru (an ancient Sanskrit technological text) and exemplified in the ships and boats of old Indian arts."

Chinese historian Dr. Li-Chi also discovered an astonishing resemblance between the Chinese clay pottery and the pottery discovered at Mohenja daro on the Indian continent. Yuag Xianji, member of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference, speaking at the C. P. Ramaswamy Aiyar Foundation, Madras, March 27 1984 said,

" Recent discoveries of ruins of Hindu temples in Southeast China provided further evidence of Hinduism in China. Both Buddhism and Hinduism were patronized by the rulers. In the 6th century A.D. the royal family was Hindu for two generations. The following Tang dynasty (7th to the 9th century A.D.) also patronized both Hinduism and Buddhism because the latter was but a branch of Hinduism. Religious wars were unknown in ancient China. There was extensive maritime trade and religious exchanges between India and China at this period (Ad 1-600) and the massive expansion of Indian influence into southern China through Jih-nan and Chiao-chih, in what is now northern Vietnam.

Albert Etienne Terrien de Lacouperie, author of Western Origins of Chinese Civilization states that the maritime intercourse of India with China dates from about 680 B.C. when the sea traders of the Indian ocean" whose "Chiefs were Hindus" founded a colony, called Lang-ga, after the Indian name Lanka, about the present gulf of Kiaotchoa....And throughout this period the monopoly of the sea borne trade of China was in their hands."

In the second century A.D., Indians from the Sindhu during the time of Rudradaman, the Khshatrapa Satrap of Kattiawad, took presents by sea to China.

(source: Milinda Panha - Vide p. 127-327). Refer to Marco Polo’s epic journey to China was a big conTeam Folks


lots more on ..http://www.hinduwisdom.info/India_and_China.htm
 
Thanks for admitting that ROC is not part of China. Please tell your govt to drop the claim.

Haha, nice try :lol: but it's too late, your lovely government has already recognized ROC is part of China, dare it say the contrary???:rofl:
 
It was kind a spiritual to me when I was standing in-front of the tree where Buddha attained enlightenment..

Bodh gaya in bihar (India) is the place where a king transformed to Buddha.

People from Korea, Thailand,Srilanka and many other places were there.
 
Hehe, not he hypocrite, but you are hypocrite, I don't discuss with you on whether the sentence is right, but you minister here quote this is very ridiculous, just can delude you inidan, from you comments, I think you are satisfied by your minister and the sentence.

If talking about the sentence quoted, tell me how much Chinese aggree with it? I have said, Hu is just a Chinese normal literati, you believe every Chinese literati and what they said?

If you don't like the original quote or the requoting...take it up with someone who cares.

Petition the Chinese govt to release a rebuttal or denial. Show that Chinese cares about it like they do about preventing pictures of Tiananmen Square massacre appearing in internet searches.

If talking about the sentence quoted, tell me how much Chinese aggree with it? I have said, Hu is just a Chinese normal literati, you believe every Chinese literati and what they said?

Where did I say I fully agreed with the statement(s)? I wouldn't word it as "dominated"...China is much too large for that and has much strength in its own indigenous Taoist and Confucian philosophies.

But the role of such literature as Journey to the West (the quest of the great monk to get the Sutras from the land to the west - India) is undeniable on China. Its just one example. If its not huge, its certainly significant. We can disagree on the extent thats fine...not an issue for me. I mean can the influence be measured in % terms or numbers? No. It comes from what we perceive and have studied....and that is obviously susceptible to bias.

My issue is with the trolls saying that Buddha has nothing to do with India, which is just factually incorrect.....since India in historical sense is not bounded by just the modern day republic's borders.

Play huge role? how huge? do you know what's the host culture of China Culture? if buddhism is not host culture of China culture, how could it dominate Chinese? is it a joke, I have said there are influence on China, but dominating, it is exaggerated, just can delude yourself.

Do you curse us because we don't aggree with you? hehe, Buddism merciful, you don't know that? and tell me, how many Chinese are atheist? it is not we try to poke political holes in, but you try, you minister should attend to his own work, but, I don't think you indian can elect right leader and officials.

Are you putting this all through some translation software back and forth? I am only getting the basic message of what you are trying to convey.

A huge role can be played without it being dominating (maybe thats too strong I agree). Where am I cursing anyone? I just dont agree with the people saying Buddhism has nothing to do with India.

If you dont like who we elect, we dont care. They are our leaders and officials and are none of your business. Am I commenting on Chinese leaders and people in general?...its one or two individuals here who seem to be angry that Buddhism is naturally associated with India worldwide, strongly and undeniably. The main focal point of Buddhism is in Bodh Gaya, which is within India.

Haha, nice try :lol: but it's too late, your lovely government has already recognized ROC is part of China, dare it say the contrary???:rofl:

The issue is not what we say, its what you are saying: That because this original guy is from ROC (Taiwan), he does not represent China.

Its good to know this division lies internally within the Chinese people. Inherently you do not accept ROC to be part of China....and are thus perpetuating One China as yet another political exercise to satisfy your ego.
 
You must be so angry when pretty much anyone says Buddhism is from India. Good I am glad it causes you to be so.

And do you think human beings orginated in China or something? That China was completely insulated from outside cultures except for the great Nepalese export of Buddhism :D. Chinese culture, language and roots all do not come from China either.....but eventually trace their roots to Africa. So I guess nothing comes from China as well if we are to go by your strict historical definitions.

Doesn't bother me in the slightest. :P It is completely incorrect though, since (1) the Buddha was from Nepal and (2) India did not exist back then.

I have no problem with Buddhism coming from outside China, after all most of the world follows religions that originated in the Middle East, including Christianity, Islam and Hinduism (from Iranians). Nepal is a lot closer than the Middle East at least.

As for where humans originated, well everyone on Earth has DNA markers indicating an origin in Africa at some point. So that's where we came from, until we find a human who does not have these DNA markers, which seems extremely unlikely.
 
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