What's new

What would happen if US, EU, Japan, S.Korea completely cut business with China?

Status
Not open for further replies.

kankan326

SENIOR MEMBER
Joined
Jun 7, 2011
Messages
5,217
Reaction score
-13
Country
China
Location
China
100% decoupling is not possible. Especially for EU. Every country has its own independent China policy. Supposing this extreme scenario happens, what the world would be like?

My conclusion is: Both China and the west are the victims. But China will be the winner.

For China, Of course there would be short term economic chaos. But I believe Chinese living standard will resume to the level of today in 5 years. In 2021, China’s trade surplus with US is 676 billion USD. With EU the trade surplus is 250 billion USD. China has trade deficit with Japan and S.Korea. Overall China will lose 900 billion USD trade surplus. It won’t hurt China too much in the long run. 1)SE Asian countries, India, Latin American countries, African countries will benefit from the new cold war. And they will have bigger purchasing power for Chinese goods. 2)China’s FX reserve benefits Americans more than Chinese. China used most of its FX reserve to buy US debts. Which improves Americans welfare, instead of Chinese. Just like Chinese economist Wen Tiejun said: “China is like a cow. US stripped its cowhide twice. First by using USD to import cheap goods from China. Second by selling US debts. Most US dollars will come back to US for free .”

For the west, the consequences of cold war 2.0 will be much more serious than arrogant westerners expected. China is not Soviet Union. Who was an armed natural resources exporter. Decoupling with China will hit west’s economy very hard.

From demand aspect to say. Westerners are optimistic because they are the low end and middle end products buyers and they believe China is replaceable. Fact is China is not replaceable. Building an intact no-China supply chain outside China needs huge amount of money. The west doesn’t have that money. Even if the new supply chain, by all odds, is successful built. It can not compete with China’s because only China can make best cost performance. People in the west have to pay more money for lower quality goods. This supply chain will specially serve for the western countries. Other non-west countries will still buy goods produced by China-in supply chain.

From supply aspect to say. The west firstly will lose China market. Which is 25% S.Korea total export, 50% Germany car export, 20% Apple sale. The number would be bigger if take the indirect export to China and investment income from China into account. Secondly, China will have to build its own high end goods industries. Once breakthroughs are made, China will sell them to other non-west countries. Western countries will become poorer for losing business to China in world market. Don’t doubt China has the ability to produce high end goods. It’s already happening in many fields. Semiconductor will be next.

The west will lose big part of money printing privilege. US dollar and Euro will definitely not be used in the China-in supply chain. Countries in this supply chain will not play west’s cow role anymore. Non-west countries will be richer. West will be poorer.

There are two reasons that guarantee China will win cold war 2.0.

1)China has an intelligent, hardworking, disciplined, creative work force. Which the west combined can not compete with in quantity, and in quality in the long run.

2)Average income of Chinese labors is much lower than west’s. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m not going to talk about low cost stuff. After full competition between the two camps, the income levels of the two sides will tend to reflect their real quality. Which means Chinese income will grow while westerners’ salary will drop, sharply. Which side will fall first then?
 
Last edited:
Not going to happen until some other country replaces china which has an industrial base and is very competitive.
 
Not going to happen until some other country replaces china which has an industrial base and is very competitive.
Which country is "some other country"?
 
100% decoupling is not possible. Especially for EU. Every country has its own independent China policy. Supposing this extreme scenario happens, what the world would be like?

My conclusion is: Both China and the west are the victims. But China will be the winner.

For China, Of course there would be short term economic chaos. But I believe Chinese living standard will resume to the level of today in 5 years. In 2021, China’s trade surplus with US is 676 billion USD. With EU the trade surplus is 250 billion USD. China has trade deficit with Japan and S.Korea. Overall China will lose 900 billion USD trade surplus. It won’t hurt China too much in the long run. 1)SE Asian countries, India, Latin American countries, African countries will benefit from the new cold war. And they will have bigger purchasing power for Chinese goods. 2)China’s FX reserve benefit Americans more than Chinese. China used most of its FX reserve to buy US debts. Which improves Americans welfare, instead of Chinese. Just like Chinese economist Wen Tiejun said: “China is like a cow. US stripped its cowhide twice. First by using USD to import cheap goods from China. Second by selling US debts. Most US dollars will come back to US for free .”

For the west, the consequences of cold war 2.0 will be much more serious than arrogant westerners expected. China is not Soviet Union. Who was an armed natural resources exporter. Decoupling with China will hit west’s economy very hard.

From demand aspect to say. Westerners are optimistic because they are the low end and middle end products buyers and they believe China is replaceable. Fact is China is not replaceable. Building an intact no-China supply chain outside China needs huge amount of money. The west doesn’t have that money. Even if the new supply chain, at all odds, is successful built. It can not compete with China’s because only China can make best cost performance. People in the west have to pay more money for lower quality goods. This supply chain will specially serve for the western countries. Other non-west countries will still buy goods produced by China-in supply chain.

From supply aspect to say. The west firstly will lose China market. Which is 25% S.Korea total export, 50% Germany car export, 20% Apple sale. The number would be bigger if take the indirect export to China and investment income from China into account. Secondly, China will have to build its own high end goods industries. Once breakthroughs are made, China will sell them to other non-west countries. Western countries will become poorer for losing business to China in world market. Don’t doubt China has the ability to produce high end goods. It’s already happening in many fields. Semiconductor will be next.

The west will lose big part of money printing privilege. US dollar and Euro will definitely not be used in the China-in supply chain. Countries in this supply chain will not play west’s cow role anymore. Non-west countries will be richer. West will be poorer.

There are two reasons that guarantee China will win cold war 2.0.

1)China has an intelligent, hardworking, disciplined, creative work force. Which the west combined can not compete with in quantity, and in quality in the long run.

2)Average income of Chinese labors is much lower than west’s. Don’t misunderstand me. I’m not going to talk about low cost stuff. After full competition between the two camps, the income levels of the two sides will tend to reflect their real quality. Which means Chinese income will grow while westerners’ salary will drop, sharply. Which side will fall first then?
The world would slip into recession or depression in worst case scenario for 5 years. After that life would recover. China would be history.
 
The world would slip into recession or depression in worst case scenario for 5 years. After that life would recover. China would be history.
China is always history through thick and thin and emerges from the ashes stronger every time, US is not.
 
China is always history through thick and thin and emerges from the ashes stronger every time, US is not.
I don’t know if you want to return to a China before opening to the world.
 
I don’t know if you want to return to a China before opening to the world.
The world is not the west, especially in today world, This time China will make centuries old western global domination a thing of the past, you probably will go down with your white masters, they are just making their last struggle.
 
The world is not the west, especially in today world, This time China will make centuries old western global domination a thing of the past, you probably will go down with your white masters, they are just making their last struggle.
It’s never good to hype up nationalism. That leads to nothing. No, the world is not the west, the world is intertwined. China could share the same fate with Putin’s Russia. I don’t know if you want it.
 
Would suck for consumerism in the west. Would bankrupt China and create massive unemployment on a never seen before scale.

Most of the factories in China are consumer goods for the rest of the world. This is what drives its export economy.
 
It’s never good to hype up nationalism. That leads to nothing. No, the world is not the west, the world is intertwined. China could share the same fate with Putin’s Russia. I don’t know if you want it.
And the US and EU should share the fate of Germany or Britain in WW Ii.
 
It’s never good to hype up nationalism. That leads to nothing. No, the world is not the west, the world is intertwined. China could share the same fate with Putin’s Russia. I don’t know if you want it.
This shows today's world and yesterday's world, you can choose to go back to your world in the past
调整大小 Trade Policy Graphic 1.jpg

pl90bh94iph91.jpg

调整大小 调整大小 11meaney-superJumbo-v2.jpg
 
You don’t understand.
The result today is the result of China opening to the world. the decision made by Deng. China would be different today.
If you think “back to the past” would be better for China because you want to sastify nationalists then you are welcome.
The world has changed, we are talking about today's world. and China is the leader of globalisation and doing fair business with every country, it's US now trying to close its doors and isolate itself, your accusation is on the wrong foot.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom