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Which will grow faster: India or Indonesia? (The Economist)

Indonesia has way higher ceiling when it comes to living standards for general population , india will keep stuck in lower middle income trap, with large swathes of pops being extremely poor.
India isn't stagnant that it will remain stuck in a "low income trap", a better example of a low income trapped nation in real life would be Venezuela, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Somalia etc since their GDP per capita has stagnated at low income levels.

India will most likely be stuck in a middle income trap and who knows might be able to become a high income country. Afterall India just needs trade surplus to bring rupee back to the higher side to increase GDP growth and increase nominal GDP size, now its upto India Inc and Government of India how they manage to this.

Indonesia has an advantage in natural resources exports which India doesn't have, so it helps them in being an upper middle income country.

Well the last 15 yrs suggest so, even china had 10% growth in 2010 and after that 6-8%, before than it was easily crossing 10+% between 02-07. The 2008 global financial crisis shook the very foundation of unbridled globalization. Since than the global growth has came down from 4.5% in 2000s to sub 3% between 10-20. Even Indian during 00-10 used to grow 8-9.5% in those super high growth years, but since than has levelled to 6-8%. This decade it is forecasted that global economy growth will sink to 2-3%, and 6-8% growth will be among the fastest. A direct dip of 2-3% from 20 yrs ago.
And global growth slowdown means India should be focussing on internal growth since exports growth won't increase the way we would want.
 
Well the last 15 yrs suggest so, even china had 10% growth in 2010 and after that 6-8%, before than it was easily crossing 10+% between 02-07. The 2008 global financial crisis shook the very foundation of unbridled globalization. Since than the global growth has came down from 4.5% in 2000s to sub 3% between 10-20. Even Indian during 00-10 used to grow 8-9.5% in those super high growth years, but since than has levelled to 6-8%. This decade it is forecasted that global economy growth will sink to 2-3%, and 6-8% growth will be among the fastest. A direct dip of 2-3% from 20 yrs ago.

With a population equivalent of China, India can pull it off if they can industrialize at the same rate as China in the 90s and 2000s. Anyway, it's not such an important discussion. I wish India well.

India isn't stagnant that it will remain stuck in a "low income trap", a better example of a low income trapped nation in real life would be Venezuela, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Somalia etc since their GDP per capita has stagnated at low income levels.

India will most likely be stuck in a middle income trap and who knows might be able to become a high income country. Afterall India just needs trade surplus to bring rupee back to the higher side to increase GDP growth and increase nominal GDP size, now its upto India Inc and Government of India how they manage to this.

India and I think BD too will reach upper middle income status in 20 years max. Whether both countries will become as developed as western Europe or Japan is to be seen, I don't know. If it does happen, could take 50 years or more.
 
India and I think BD too will reach upper middle income status in 20 years max. Whether both countries will become as developed as western Europe or Japan is to be seen, I don't know. If it does happen, could take 50 years or more.
You mean high-income bracket I guess, both India and Bangladesh will breach upper middle income bracket before the end of this decade.

With a population equivalent of China, India can pull it off if they can industrialize at the same rate as China in the 90s and 2000s. Anyway, it's not such an important discussion. I wish India well.
I don't think India can replicate china in industrialisation, whatever industries we have mostly cater domestic demand, unlike china which caters global demand.
 
You mean high-income bracket I guess, both India and Bangladesh will breach upper middle income bracket before the end of this decade.


I don't think India can replicate china in industrialisation, whatever industries we have mostly cater domestic demand, unlike china which caters global demand.

I mean this https://datahelpdesk.worldbank.org/.../906519-world-bank-country-and-lending-groups

India and BD will be within the upper middle income bracket of $4,256 and $13,205 with the top end achievable in 20 years max.
 
Optimists say India's exports can touch $2 trillion in 4 years i.e. 22% annual growth, even if it takes 5 years it'll be 17% annual growth, and in 7 years rate required would be 12% every year.


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Tomorrow our statistic biro will release Q1 economic growth and India usually release their data in the end of the month. We will likely know it which one is the fastest within G20 group this month. I expect whole 2023 economic growth of the two countries will not likely be too different with their Q1 economic growth.

I expect Indonesia can grow at 5.1 % in Q1 2023.

AlhamduliLLAH

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Indonesia’s Q1 growth beats forecasts on resilient consumption​


  • GDP expands 5.03% in first quarter, beating 4.97% forecast
  • Exports growth decelerates as global commodity boom recedes
By
Grace Sihombing and
Claire Jiao
May 5, 2023 at 09:20 GMT+7Updated on May 5, 2023 at 10:15 GMT+7

Indonesia’s Q1 growth beats forecasts on resilient consumption​


JAKARTA - Indonesia’s economy accelerated last quarter as the nation benefited from strong domestic consumption, even as exports took a knock from slowing global demand.

Gross domestic product (GDP) rose 5.03 per cent in the three months through March from a year ago, the statistics office said on Friday. That was faster than the median estimate of 4.97 per cent in a Bloomberg survey of economists.

Compared to the fourth quarter of 2022, the economy shrank 0.92 per cent in the first quarter, still better than the economists’ median estimate for a 1 per cent contraction. This dip follows the seasonal pattern over the years, the nation’s statistics agency said.

As slowing global demand saps exports that make up about a quarter of South-east Asia’s largest economy, focus will turn to domestic consumption to shore up expansion. The Eid al-Fitr celebrations last month should help boost demand further, based on strong retail sales and improved consumer confidence.

Private consumption grew 4.54 per cent last quarter, accelerating slightly from 4.48 per cent in the previous three-month period. It remains the largest contributor to Indonesia’s economic output, though its share has fallen to about half of GDP from close to 60 per cent in 2020, latest data showed.

Room for rate cut​

Bank Indonesia has already halted its monetary policy tightening after price pressures eased from a seven-year high. With the headline inflation rate looking set to return within the central bank’s 2 per cent-4 per cent target band sooner than expected, some analysts see room for an extended pause or even rate cuts that could bolster growth.

Meanwhile, exports expanded 11.68 per cent in the first quarter, a much slower pace than the near-15 per cent it recorded in the previous quarter. Resource-rich Indonesia saw lower prices for coal, palm oil, crude oil and nickel as the global commodity boom recedes.

According to Satria Sambijantoro, economist at PT Bahana Sekuritas, outbound shipments could suffer a sharper pullback in the coming quarters as exporters tend to frontload orders in the year. Demand is also weakening amid rising recession risks in the United States and Europe.

Indonesia’s economy should have strong catalysts, though, from 2024 election-related spending that could both support domestic consumption and lure offshore funds that will strengthen the rupiah, Mr Sambijantoro said.

“Overall, Indonesia’s macro picture in 2023 appears resilient amid stagflation risks elsewhere, and there is hope for rebound in consumption and investments in the second-half,” he said. BLOOMBERG

 

Indonesia: first quarter GDP steady despite high inflation and slowing global trade​

Indonesia's economy managed to grow by 5% year-on-year in the first quarter of the year, fuelled by robust household spending

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International Arrivals in Indonesia Rise by 508.87 Pct in Q1​

Investor Daily
May 3, 2023 | 11:44 am

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Foreign tourists at the Hang Nadim International Airport in Batam on April 30, 2023. (Antara Photo/Teguh Prihatna)


Jakarta. Indonesia welcomed 2.24 million foreign travelers in the first quarter of 2023, marking a 508.87 percent increase compared to just 369,180 international tourists in the same period the previous year.

Indonesia said that this showed that the country was on track to meet its target of welcoming 8.5 million foreign travelers throughout 2023.

“Judging by the data, the number of foreign tourists [visiting Indonesia] continues to rise since last year. But we have yet to return to the pre-pandemic levels,” Margo Yuwono, head of the National Statistics Agency (BPS), told a press briefing in Jakarta on Tuesday.

In March alone, Indonesia saw 809,960 foreign tourists. This shows a 15.39 percent month-to-month increase. Foreign tourists traveling to Indonesia also rose 470.37 percent from March 2022 figures.

Malaysians made up 15.39 percent of the foreign vacationers Indonesia had attracted in March. The close neighbor brought 124,620 tourists into Indonesia. Followed by Singaporean tourists (13.74 percent) and Australians (11.87 percent).

According to Margo, the average foreign tourists stay in Indonesia for 9.82 days. ASEAN tourists usually stay for only 4.71 days, compared to Europeans who would spend 20.11 days.

“Nationality-wise, Russians would stay the longest in Indonesia, with their length of stay reaching 40.97 days. The average Hong Kong tourist only spends 2.27 days in Indonesia, the shortest length of stay compared to the others,” Margo said.

The occupancy rate of star hotels in March reached 46.26 percent, with guests normally staying for 1.67 nights. Non-star hotels saw a 21.26 percent occupancy rate in March.

Indonesia initially aimed for 7.4 million foreign tourists in 2023. But the government decided to raise the target to 8.5 million foreign travelers.

Read More: Indonesia Aims to Attract 7.4m Foreign Tourists in 2023

Domestic Travel and Eid Holidays
Domestic travel is also on the rise, although BPS data so far has only updated the statistics for 2022. Last year, domestic tourists made 734.86 million trips, up by 19.82 percent from 2021 numbers. The Eid season fell in May last year, during which Indonesia booked 78.83 million domestic tourist trips.

According to the Tourism Ministry, Indonesia’s tourism sector generated Rp 335 trillion ($22.8 billion) in economic turnover during the 2023 Eid holidays. This is much higher than the earlier forecast of Rp 248 trillion. Many domestic tourists also spent their Eid holidays in Malioboro (Yogyakarta), Ciwidey (West Java), and Lembang (West Java), to name a few.

 
I
The way india is preparing for war against Pak, its like signing its death warrant anyway

And besides, if the WEF gets its way there won’t be much left. Look how they’re destroying countries one by one. The great reset doesn’t allow any country to grow when its time fir destruction
Delusional, India isn't preparing for war with Pakistan, not at least for the next 20 years
 

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