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Why India and Pakistan will keep growing apart

I am not saying this that is what your country is searching in Internet...

Being a Hindu Insh'Allah I will even pray 100 times in a mosque - for Pakistan and India not becoming one country... so that I don't have to live with a person filled with Bigotry mind set like you...

1/3 of Pakistani wants to leave the country and even your PM accepts it smiling shamelessly...

Why search internet, just visit the temples in Mathura.

The number of Indians who have left India for earning money in foreign countries probably equals the total population of Pakistan. And still the number of Indians living below poverty line is more than four times that of the population of Pakistan and more than the total population of entire Europe.

When you pray in the mosque 100 times, please do remember me once.
 
Why search internet, just visit the temples in Mathura.

The number of Indians who have left India for earning money in foreign countries probably equals the total population of Pakistan. And still the number of Indians living below poverty line is more than four times that of the population of Pakistan and more than the total population of entire Europe.

When you pray in the mosque 100 times, please do remember me once.

:lol: :rofl: Quit pulling stats out of your behind .Last report of Poverty rates by World bank puts indias poverty rate at 32.7% and Pakistan at 21 % in terms of only income .

Last I remember Pakistan was a low Human development nation and India medium which is a much more holistic measure of development of a country. Nuff said.;)
 
When you don't have nothing to argue...you guys bring Indian poverty, toilets etc.....Grow up kids.....Want to debate raise your level....
@topic
Difference in Foreign Policy and Political Philosophy, latter one is not good but certainly worked just good enough to put us on development track...
 
I certainly doubt that.. your membership here is a testament to that being incorrect.
Otherwise anything Pakistani, news or opinions.. on any matter should not have invited any "Damns"..
But they sure do.. with varying levels of sanity...cynicism.. and bitter hatred that vary across the spectrum of Indian members

All the hilarious propaganda on here about India needs to be countered . Don't mind but most Indians are here for that purpose . This forum discusses India more than Pakistan that is why Indians join , start discussing Pakistan more and India less and you will see lesser Indian members around . You have my word.
 
All the hilarious propaganda on here about India needs to be countered . Don't mind but most Indians are here for that purpose . This forum discusses India more than Pakistan that is why Indians join , start discussing Pakistan more and India less and you will see lesser Indian members around . You have my word.

Sadly if Pakistani members try to counter much more venomous and vile propaganda at similar Indian sites..they are not given the leeway you get here.. and are instead banned instantly.
So no, this forum is for Pakistanis to voice their views on any matter and will stay as such.
 
Sadly if Pakistani members try to counter much more venomous and vile propaganda at similar Indian sites..they are not given the leeway you get here.. and are instead banned instantly.
So no, this forum is for Pakistanis to voice their views on any matter and will stay as such.

There are Pakistani members on many Indian forums who counter Indians in a civilized way and survive but then there are others who take too much liberty and end up getting banned . More venomous and vile , well that is your word against mine and cannot be proven .

And since Pakistanis are allowed to discuss here whatever they want and they are so insistent on discussing every subject about India that goes far beyond just military and defence then be don't be surprised to see more Indians joining .

My original point was that most in India don't give a damn about Pakistan but propaganda needs to be countered as internet is accessible to everyone around the world and therefore sir Indians will continue to linger around .
 
Why search internet, just visit the temples in Mathura.

The number of Indians who have left India for earning money in foreign countries probably equals the total population of Pakistan. And still the number of Indians living below poverty line is more than four times that of the population of Pakistan and more than the total population of entire Europe.

When you pray in the mosque 100 times, please do remember me once.

We don't hide our emotion related to sexual stuffs, you are the one who preach morality related to sex - but behind the screen search orf Donkey sex, Camel sex and all kind of nasty things in google search -shame on you!!!

Remember you For what ?? for making the life of minority in your country miserable!!! example In 1951, Hindus constituted 22 percentage of the Pakistani population (that includes the modern day Bangladesh); Today, the share of Hindus are down to 1.7 percent in Pakistan !!!

The largest number of Indian Immigrants is in USA and the population is 2.8 million and DO YOU THINK THAT IS EQUAL TO 180 MILLION PAKISTAN POPULATION?? - talk some thing sense and relevant...Even the Chinese population is USA in 3.8 million!!!

Next largest immigrants from India living is UK which is 1.4 million - for Pakistan the number of their UK population is 1.2 Million - so stop your nonsense, India have almost 7 times more population than Pakistan yet in UK we have only 200 thousand more Indians, same with other countries - such as Pakistani UAE (1,200,000) and Saudi Arabia (1,500,000) - Indian in UAE (1,400,000) and Saudi Arabia (1,500,000).
 
Why search internet, just visit the temples in Mathura.

The number of Indians who have left India for earning money in foreign countries probably equals the total population of Pakistan. And still the number of Indians living below poverty line is more than four times that of the population of Pakistan and more than the total population of entire Europe.

When you pray in the mosque 100 times, please do remember me once.

just shut the phuck up when u have nothing to argue about anything.
 
:lol: :rofl: Quit pulling stats out of your behind .Last report of Poverty rates by World bank puts indias poverty rate at 32.7% and Pakistan at 21 % in terms of only income .

Last I remember Pakistan was a low Human development nation and India medium which is a much more holistic measure of development of a country. Nuff said.;)

32.7 % of 1.2 billion Indians would come to over 400 million Indians. And instead of improving the living standards of your own, you blame Pakistan for not having done enough for it own people.

Skewed logic. More needs to be said than presenting illogical Nuffs.
 
i agree that pakistan and india will keep growing apart. however to deny that we are similar or share commonalities such as history, food, language, dress is absurd and is a distortion. as much as pakistanis want to erase their "indianess" and associate with arabs or believe that they dropped from the sky spontaneously...we can't we need to accept the reality...but we also need to move towards creating a stronger national identity that does not rely on hating or demonizing the indians (i kno thats hard after coming in contact with indian members on pdf:P) but thrives on national accomplishments. theres still a long way to go for that...but hopefully if we dont annihilate each other before that we may be able to accept each other and move forward towards friendly neighbourly relations...
and come on! ban the sari??...whats wrong with u guys! lets take a women's poll and decide what they want before imposing our personal dress codes on them!
 
32.7 % of 1.2 billion Indians would come to over 400 million Indians. And instead of improving the living standards of your own, you blame Pakistan for not having done enough for it own people.

Skewed logic. More needs to be said than presenting illogical Nuffs.

Very true 400 million is a huge number, but India is doing many correct measures to eradicate this poverty - but no one is having magic want to wipe the poverty over night, it will be done gradually, after India opened it's economy 20 years back India have lifted almost 330 million people out of poverty to make them middle class families which is equal to UAS population...If you see the PDF previous posts you will understand who uses the poverty tag - if India sends a moon mission, conducts CWG games or F1 Race by private company, Sends a satellite or tests missile or any development projects most of the Pakistanis will jump in to the thread and say millions live in poverty and Indians wasting the money, then it becomes necessary for us to point-out your own house in which you have similar share of population living in poverty and yet you spend very less on development, even lesser than India and more on defense budget...

India's share of defense budget on GDP 2.5% - Pakistan 2.8%
India's share of education on GDP 4.1% - Pakistan 1.8%!!!

India spends more on poor to uplift them...but there are countries which India can envy on thier education expenditure example Cuba...

CUBA education share 18.1%!!! on it's GDP and ranks number one
 
Half decade old but gold article......


PAKISTAN IS NOT AN ESTRANGED BROTHER

The Partition has defined Pakistan’s identity. It exists separately because there is India. This fundamental contradiction can’t be wished away

By Swapan Dasgupta


Swapan Dasgupta
When it comes to Pakistan, a very large number of Indians nurture a peculiar complex. Jaswant Singh, whose bestseller, A Call To Honour, represents the candid confessions of an Indian Tory — as distinguished from a right-winger—is no exception. His second chapter is entitled “Born of the same womb-Pakistan”. It’s a formulation calculated to put him on par with those sentimental souls who travel to the Wagah border to light candles each year on August 14.

Of course, it is not as simple as that. The Wagah candle brigade harbours an Amar-Akbar-Anthony vision of South Asian fraternity, whereas Jaswant’s perception of Indian identity is rooted in the culture and folklore of Rajputana. Where the twain do meet is in the heartfelt conviction that the Partition of India in 1947 was a monumental tragedy which ought to be negated sometime in the future.

People differ as to who and what was responsible for a large chunk of Indian Muslims going their own way. Jaswant, taking his cue from historian Ayesha Jalal, is comfortable heaping all the opprobrium on the Congress and Nehru. The “progressives”, who also include Left-leaning Muslims, blame the messy separation on the Muslim League’s willingness to dance to a divisive tune.

What linked these two versions of history is the conviction that Partition was a consequence of “high” politics that scarcely touched the “people”. By this logic, Partition was akin to two brothers moving into separate wings of the ancestral property and being separated by a line drawn by Sir Cyril Radcliffe. Separate living arrangements, it was implied, didn’t entail the end of kinship.

My belief in the sameness of India and Pakistan collapsed in a London bar some 30 years ago. I was sitting with some friends enjoying the mandatory Friday night drink when a South Asian gentleman sat down in the adjoining table. During a lull in our conversation he butted in abruptly and asked me: “Where are you from?” I was in no mood for polite conversation and, with a bored expression, answered: “India”. “I’m from Pakistan”, he replied.

“It’s the same thing,” I retorted, anxious not to prolong this exchange.

“Same thing?” he asked incredulously. “Oh no, it’s not the same thing. It’s not the same thing at all.”



My belief in the sameness of India and Pakistan collapsed in a London bar some 30 years ago
For close to six decades, well-intentioned Indians have been trying to keep alive the fiction that the divide between India and Pakistan is politically contrived. The drawing rooms of the metros are replete with anecdotes of that Pakistani taxi driver who gave a discounted fare to a visiting Indian. The Sunday supplements abound with mushy articles by apprentice journalists describing their journey to the house in Lahore where grandmother grew up. Grandma’s family, needless to add, “Owned half of Lahore.”

The Lahore disease has proved infectious. Last year, it claimed its most celebrated victim in the form of LK Advani. What prompted Advani to go beyond the demands of protocol at Jinnah’s mausoleum? How did the man Pakistan believed was the “invisible hand” that scuttled the Agra summit become so weak-kneed about Pakistan? Advani proceeded on the belief that the biggest obstacle in the path of an enduring Hindu-Muslim understanding in India was the memory and consequences of Partition. If the rulers agreed to bury the hatchet and agreed to stop terrorism and respect each other’s borders, the ensuing peace dividend would transform Hindu-Muslim relations radically. In the summer of 2004, many ‘eminent’ Muslims privately advised Advani that if the BJP persevered with the peace process, it would win the confidence and votes of Muslims.

I was personally witness to one Muslim intellectual telling Advani that for Muslims, the 2004 general election would be as important a turning point as 1952. In 1952, the Muslims broke with their earlier infatuation with the Muslim League — and, for that matter, the slogan of Pakistan — and voted overwhelmingly for the Congress. Now, in 2004, they were on the verge of effecting another tectonic shift—this time to the BJP! In hindsight, this sounds absolutely cuckoo. However, in the heady atmosphere of early 2004, when almost everything seemed to be going right, there was a market for such fanciful ideas within the BJP.

Of course, the 2004 general election didn’t turn out the way many expected. The Muslim vote for the BJP remained in the realms of fantasy. However, the idea of making the BJP acceptable to Muslims persisted. One of its misplaced manifestations was Advani’s intervention at the Jinnah mausoleum in Karachi.

To a large extent the problem is generational. Till the late 60s a section of Muslims, particularly the underclass, had a macabre fascination for Pakistan. In Uttar Pradesh, where the Pakistan movement originated, middle-class Muslims imagined emigration was the escape route from the loss of a way of life. The aggressive Hindi nationalism and the corresponding decline of Urdu also convinced many Muslims that India was not the place to be. Such comforting thoughts of a Promised Land across the border disappeared with the creation of Bangladesh. Coupled with the beginnings of the Mohajir problem, the 1971 war convinced Muslims that it was not worth reposing faith in Pakistan. Moreover, the ignominious surrender in Dhaka persuaded the more obtuse sections that the legend of one Muslim soldier being equal to 10 Hindus was a statistical miscalculation.

What these anecdotal titbits go to suggest is that for one generation of Hindus, Muslims and Pakistan are virtually synonymous. Clobbering Pakistan also implied showing the local Muslim his place too. In Gujarat 2002, the local population was quite clear in its mind who Narendra Modi was actually referring to when he flayed Mian Musharraf. Why single out Modi for opprobrium? Immediately after the 7/11 blasts, the pm, his nsa and foreign office mandarins have been vocal in accusing Pakistan. So far, there is nothing concrete to link Pakistan but there is mounting evidence to indicate that radical Islam, another euphemism for terrorism, has struck roots in India. It is politically unacceptable to speak openly of the reality of a Fifth Column in our cities. The Samajwadi Party and other bleeding hearts are already protesting against religious profiling by the police. Consequently, with this government too, Musharraf has become the euphemism for rabid mullahs and their murderous followers. What Modi said angrily in Gujarati after Godhra is being said in understated English by senior upa functionaries today.

The difference ends here. Whereas many in Gujarat believed that popular retribution is the only way to fight terrorism, the upa government has thrown up its hands in despair. It cannot go after all the terrorist cells because the political cost is likely to be enormous. At the same time, its diplomatic offensive against Pakistan lacks credibility. Consequently, it has fallen on the “Mumbai spirit” — the contemporary term for old-fashioned Hindu fatalism.

The Mumbai spirit is to political mobilisation what the Upanishads are to Hinduism — a mass of abstractions which establishes intellectual superiority in a climate of political servitude. It is a manifestation of both fear and defeatism, and is likely to be interpreted as such by Islamists. There is a feeling in the Muslim community, quite openly articulated in Pakistan, that Hindus lack the mental wherewithal to wield power. “We were rulers here for 800 years. Inshaallah, we shall return to power once again,” threatened the Shahi Imam of Delhi’s Jama Masjid on July 17, after accusing the authorities of targeting every “bearded man” in the country. The Shahi Imam is a loose cannon who defies the expedient stereotype of the pious maulvi. What then will they say of the belief, again widespread in Pakistan, that the problem with Hindus is their deep sense of inferiority vis-á-vis Muslims? This, of course, is a peculiarly North Indian phenomenon but it continues to shape Indo-Pak diplomacy. The good UP small-town Hindu genuflects before the so-called “refined Urdu” of the Muslim feudals while his Punjabi counterpart drools over the greasy food served in the bylanes of Lahore. Together they add up to the foreign policy conclusion that the rogue State be given another chance to affirm its allegiance to a composite culture.

It is a colossal blunder that stems from the ‘estranged brother’ act. Pakistan, it is important to realise once and for all, is just a troublesome neighbour who has little in common left with us. We can’t change our neighbour but we are not obliged to love him either.
 

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