China-India Standoff 2020 - Outcome

[StormBreaker]

IK's rhetoric from last two months regarding GB, SMK's recent tweets. They had intelligence, this PLA move is to dilute the impact and engage India on another front. A clear signaling... Though it won't go in to direct conflict but at least to keep them on their toes. Will give much of breathing space to Pakistan at LOC, since india had upped the ante from Kabulistan and Iran to dilute Pakistan's force on two fronts. It's quite interesting how this is playing out. India is gonna come red faced and blue eyed out of it this time around.

And Nepal also possibly on the move,

Man, I love politics

 

[BL33D]

Lol Pakistanis think this is all some big plot between Pakistan and CHina to contain India. There is only one reason why CHina is getting so desperate, it is because India is finally completing infra projects that will give it an advantage over China over certain important points. So China attempted to intrude and stop construction, but failed. Hence the buildup and standoff about 500m from LAC.

 

[StormBreaker]

Unless India fires first, there’d be no war.

Ooe bhai Block 3 ka bata yar kab wapas nazar aaega phir ?

O Shahzade,

That is a discussion in the Last Sino-US Tango thread...

For now tell me... Why did PLA move just now?

Answer....right in front of your eyes!

Mangus

Maybe,

I think, India will run to Chacha USA, Ask for help.

Times are desperate, USA is losing its dominance since quite some time, But CoViD is a catalyst, The dent on the US economic might... Might want to pull out their clowns from different areas to reduce military expenditure... God Knows maybe even Naval...

Desperate times, India running to the so called “Big Ally”, just to get ignored to MUCH extent for help,
Then to kneel down to China ?

TLDS : China watches USA empire desperate, Broken, Punches its only possible future Rival and a possible future stooge of USA, Just to make India realize that when the time comes, USA won’t help you, Obey me, You will benefit with me...

Lol Pakistanis think this is all some big plot between Pakistan and CHina to contain India. There is only one reason why CHina is getting so desperate, it is because India is finally completing infra projects that will give it an advantage over China over certain important points. So China attempted to intrude and stop construction, but failed. Hence the buildup and standoff about 500m from LAC.

Example of some projects you are referring to ?

 

[Ace of Spades]

Let's combine the factors for India..

Economy - down the drain

Covid - out of hand situation

RSS infested society; radicalism - on rise

Internal rift with Muslims - exponential growth

Kashmir - stuck

International alignments especially vis a vis US - sugar daddy not pleased

International border disputes, Pakistan, China, Nepal - Not looking good.

Now the question is how is india gonna come out of it? The thing is shri narendra Modi Ji has done what Pakistan couldn't had done in ages. Even if international players would want to get rid of him because he has proven himself a moron; this still can't be reversed. Shri Narendra Modi Ji has exploited the hidden hatred of indians and mainstreamed it to the level that it will take decades to reverse. And because of the exact same reason Indian local populace will not let another party to rule.

So it brings us to what are the options for India. She wanted to stabilize falling economy by taking investors from China, but to do so she was asked to be useful against China to contain it. My assessment was that India would never engage china in south China sea, taiwan or even in arabian sea region. They don't have capacity to do so neither the courage. However, their way of showing something to their sugar daddy was to engage Pakistan in GB, with the rhetoric to US that that's where it will help them to contain chinese expansion of BRI, CPEC the flag bearer. Two birds with one stone, showing local populace the 56 inch rhetoric, Pakistan ko sabak sikhaya and sabotaging CPEC. But now china has played her card. Interesting thing is it has upped the ante to the point that there is no blinking on their part. If China will; she will lose the upper hand in escalation ladder. Now, what's there for India to counter? Can't fight, can't withdraw. In my opinion this is going to be the new status co.

What are Indian allies gonna do about it? Directly nothing, but covertly.... keep an eye on GCC in upcoming days. Not discounting Iranian and Kabulistan's factor vis a vis Pakistan but that's being already engaged. However, economic front and GCC.... all interlinked. But on the other hand it also makes the chances of Indian false flag attack more probable. Again as i said; who is gonna blink and China is not blinking. What india does will seal her fate for a very long time, may be to the point that she will have to retreat from her position in Kashmir, initially diplomatically, later on ground as well. And that will depend on how Pakistan plays her cards. And not taking pressure from GCC, US. Interesting times are coming...

@Mangus Ortus Novem @PakSword @masterchief_mirza @StormBreaker @Slav Defence

 

[Joe Shearer]

Like Sikkim and Siachin etc, it will be interesting to see how the two big neighbours deal with each other, apart from kicking and swearing. China is quite capable to handle multiple fronts,if US wants to join the party.

Have you EVER seen China do that?

 

[Chakar The Great]

Let's combine the factors for India..

Economy - down the drain

Covid - out of hand situation

RSS infested society; radicalism - on rise

Internal rift with Muslims - exponential growth

Kashmir - stuck

International alignments especially vis a vis US - sugar daddy not pleased

International border disputes, Pakistan, China, Nepal - Not looking good.

Now the question is how is india gonna come out of it? The thing is shri narendra Modi Ji has done what Pakistan couldn't had done in ages. Even if international players would want to get rid of him because he has proven himself a moron; this still can't be reversed. Shri Narendra Modi Ji has exploited the hidden hatred of indians and mainstreamed it to the level that it will take decades to reverse. And because of the exact same reason Indian local populace will not let another party to rule.

So it brings us to what are the options for India. She wanted to stabilize falling economy by taking investors from China, but to do so she was asked to be useful against China to contain it. My assessment was that India would never engage china in south China sea, taiwan or even in arabian sea region. They don't have capacity to do so neither the courage. However, their way of showing something to their sugar daddy was to engage Pakistan in GB, with the rhetoric to US that that's where it will help them to contain chinese expansion of BRI, CPEC the flag bearer. Two birds with one stone, showing local populace the 56 inch rhetoric, Pakistan ko sabak sikhaya and sabotaging CPEC. But now china has played her card. Interesting thing is it has upped the ante to the point that there is no blinking on their part. If China will; she will lose the upper hand in escalation ladder. Now, what's there for India to counter? Can't fight, can't withdraw. In my opinion this is going to be the new status co.

What are Indian allies gonna do about it? Directly nothing, but covertly.... keep an eye on GCC in upcoming days. Not discounting Iranian and Kabulistan's factor vis a vis Pakistan but that's being already engaged. However, economic front and GCC.... all interlinked. But on the other hand it also makes the chances of Indian false flag attack more probable. Again as i said; who is gonna blink and China is not blinking. What india does will seal her fate for a very long time, may be to the point that she will have to retreat from her position in Kashmir, initially diplomatically, later on ground as well. And that will depend on how Pakistan plays her cards. And not taking pressure from GCC, US. Interesting times are coming...

@Mangus Ortus Novem @PakSword @masterchief_mirza @StormBreaker @Slav Defence

Excellent post. I completely agree its India in deep trouble, these small issues have long term consequences.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Let's combine the factors for India..

Economy - down the drain

Covid - out of hand situation

RSS infested society; radicalism - on rise

Internal rift with Muslims - exponential growth

Kashmir - stuck

International alignments especially vis a vis US - sugar daddy not pleased

International border disputes, Pakistan, China, Nepal - Not looking good.

Now the question is how is india gonna come out of it? The thing is shri narendra Modi Ji has done what Pakistan couldn't had done in ages. Even if international players would want to get rid of him because he has proven himself a moron; this still can't be reversed. Shri Narendra Modi Ji has exploited the hidden hatred of indians and mainstreamed it to the level that it will take decades to reverse. And because of the exact same reason Indian local populace will not let another party to rule.

So it brings us to what are the options for India. She wanted to stabilize falling economy by taking investors from China, but to do so she was asked to be useful against China to contain it. My assessment was that India would never engage china in south China sea, taiwan or even in arabian sea region. They don't have capacity to do so neither the courage. However, their way of showing something to their sugar daddy was to engage Pakistan in GB, with the rhetoric to US that that's where it will help them to contain chinese expansion of BRI, CPEC the flag bearer. Two birds with one stone, showing local populace the 56 inch rhetoric, Pakistan ko sabak sikhaya and sabotaging CPEC. But now china has played her card. Interesting thing is it has upped the ante to the point that there is no blinking on their part. If China will; she will lose the upper hand in escalation ladder. Now, what's there for India to counter? Can't fight, can't withdraw. In my opinion this is going to be the new status co.

What are Indian allies gonna do about it? Directly nothing, but covertly.... keep an eye on GCC in upcoming days. Not discounting Iranian and Kabulistan's factor vis a vis Pakistan but that's being already engaged. However, economic front and GCC.... all interlinked. But on the other hand it also makes the chances of Indian false flag attack more probable. Again as i said; who is gonna blink and China is not blinking. What india does will seal her fate for a very long time, may be to the point that she will have to retreat from her position in Kashmir, initially diplomatically, later on ground as well. And that will depend on how Pakistan plays her cards. And not taking pressure from GCC, US. Interesting times are coming...

@Mangus Ortus Novem @PakSword @masterchief_mirza @StormBreaker @Slav Defence

It's not the case that either China or India have instigated this move from a position of absolute strength. @Mangus Ortus Novem is asking the question "why has China done this now?" making the assumption that China needs to take such an action when it's supremely strong and by default seeking to bring that leverage to bear on multiple fronts.

I actually agree with you @aceofspades that India is in substantial internal strife and China has simply taken advantage. China is weakened in terms of its external image due to being outflanked by the western propaganda drivel, however internally it is as strong as ever, free from disorder or rebellion and infused with new nationalistic vigour as its people rally around the state during the covid recovery phase. Hence, she is relatively strong compared with India who has been caught off guard by worsening Covid (India is still in a different phase of spread), migrant worker strain, renewed Kashmir rebellion, a hot IB, Nepal's border spat and economic decline. China has acted now because of this context. Also keep in mind that in such theatres, the exact timing of actions is restricted during the year so if China intended to act, it had to do so round about now or wait another year.

I don't think there's any grand mystery here - just China edging territory off India which it always regarded as disputed, and Pakistan wholly supports China's claim.

Worth adding the quip from everybody's favourite honorary pdf'er Sun Tzu: when you're weak, act strong; when you're strong, act weak.

Second time today.

 

[Han Patriot]

It has always been this way. The Chinese always make moves which normally go unopposed or they discover the threshold or create an entirely new one.

I also see this in conjunction with what we did in Doklam where we didnt budge about the fact they were building infra near a very critical territory to our security. The matter isnt going to go down quickly until we stop building near LAC which it doesnt seem like we will. These confrontations in my opinion will not completely washout with time but create a new normal of more frequent transgressions.

Our infamous bureaucratic indecisiveness regarding the Huawei and the Taiwan issue seems to be the cause.

And we seriously need to take a side. We are sipping too much of the Wuhan and Mallapuram spirit. The Chinese will never show us an ounce of respect or equity if we do not respond them in kind. We need to utilize some of our leverage and create some new ones. The costs for such action by China must be raised. That doesnt require you to go to war. Just clever and confident foreign policy.

It's an Indian provocation to divert the domestic issues. Typical Modi tactic. He knew China will react when India does a provocation. The virus spread is out of control now and the economy is fcked, migrants are starving..... And he is sprinkling flower petals to frontliners? This guy is an attention whore like Trump, all about media and no substance despite some crazy authoratarian actions like demonetisation. They never think about repuecussions. The virus will spread in India and get even more serious.

 

[tower9]

It's an Indian provocation to divert the domestic issues. Typical Modi tactic. He knew China will react when India does a provocation. The virus spread is out of control now and the economy is fcked, migrants are starving..... And he is sprinkling flower petals to frontliners? This guy is an attention whore like Trump, all about media and no substance despite some crazy authoratarian actions like demonetisation. They never think about repuecussions. The virus will spread in India and get even more serious.

Just like when India had their conflict with Pakistan over a year ago. Imran Khan was reaching out in a televised speech, very logical, very persuasive, yet absolutely no response from Modi at all.

Modi is a very manipulative and sneaky figure actually when you come to observe his actions.

 

[Han Patriot]

Just like when India had their conflict with Pakistan over a year ago. Imran Khan was reaching out in a televised speech, very logical, very persuasive, yet absolutely no response from Modi at all.

Modi is a very manipulative and sneaky figure actually when you come to observe his actions.

He is sneaky and shrewd but doesn't mean he is capable he seems to be doing things on a impulse, no proper planning, just a show of diktat. India is now more divided than ever and he can't even do a proper lockdown. Ppl are eating roadkill and he is scattering flower petals, its all media oriented like bollywood movies, he will say something like I will kiss the feet of these heroes, but then the frontliners would get bashed up abs kicked our of their rented accommodations and he wouldn't do a shit. In China frontliners are treated with respect and given the best, Xi doesn't need to put on a show

 

[tower9]

He is sneaky and shrewd but doesn't mean he is capable he seems to be doing things on a impulse, no proper planning, just a show of diktat. India is now more divided than ever and he can't even do a proper lockdown. Ppl are eating roadkill and he is scattering flower petals, its all media oriented like bollywood movies, he will say something like I will kiss the feet of these heroes, but then the frontliners would get bashed up abs kicked our of their rented accommodations.

Well just like the United States, Indian politicians conduct many of their foreign policy decisions for domestic reasons even though at times it is reckless. It's one of the weaknesses of a democratic system.

That's why other countries should be careful when they wish for a "democratic China", imagine if Chinese leaders bombed other countries to appease domestic audiences.

 

[Han Patriot]

Well just like the United States, Indian politicians conduct many of their foreign policy decisions for domestic reasons even though at times it is reckless. It's one of the weaknesses of a democratic system.

That's why other countries should be careful when they wish for a "democratic China", imagine if Chinese leaders bombed other countries to appease domestic audiences.

Yah he does seem like a watered down Trump, sort of like an actor.

 

[pakpride00090]

It seems quite clearly that this is a reaction to the pressure that China is facing at the moment. The border with India is not at all one of their areas of great concern; their concentration has been and continues to be their front with Taiwan, and in the naval arena, the South China Sea. These petty squabbles are China's piqued reaction to India's undutiful support of other countries to the demand for an investigation into China's management of the Covid-19 crisis; to the Indian flirting with the US proposal for a loosely-linked alliance to support their efforts against Chinese expansion into the South China Sea; and to the Indian deviation from her earlier unconditional support for the PRC.

It does not seem to be very deep in intent, but is merely a Chinese warning to a disobedient neighbour.

Links to their proposed investment in Gilgit-Baltistan cannot be ruled out as a secondary motive.

Finally, in the medium term, in the time-tested methodology of the Chinese state, there is always a step taken towards their long-term objectives, in this case, towards expansion into disputed territory, converting disputed territory into settled, and undisputed territory into disputed.

Low quality analysis... Reminds me of typical Indian:-

Pigeon crossed indian border , News plastered all over media

Big daddy China comes in , typical indian makes thousands of excuses and trivializes the matter.

On a serious note :-

This is a major cope.

The Chinese aren’t even saying anything about it, their public doesn’t even know this is happening. If it was about diverting public attention or reminding India of its breaches then Wang Yi would have at least mentioned it in his pubic presser yesterday but he had bigger fish to fry.

The actual reality is that India is almost inconsequential to China and the differential in the two countries ability to project power is too vast now. China is literally just reminding GOI of that fact.

All this chest thumping and “we will take Azad Kashmir” rhetoric by the Indian army and government is causing uncertainty for Chinese projects in Gilgit Baltistan.

How do you fix that? You place 10k troops in a region barely manned by India and divert their 900k deployment on the Pakistani border to that side. You also get Nepal to stir up a border dispute and further thin out deployments on each front.

The Indian military’s two-front war strategy is almost comically dumb.

 

[tower9]

Shit tier analysis... Reminds me of typical Indian:-

Pigeon crossed indian border , News plastered all over media

Big daddy China comes in , typical indian makes thousands of excuses and trivializes the matter.

On a serious note :-

This is a major cope.

The Chinese aren’t even saying anything about it, their public doesn’t even know this is happening. If it was about diverting public attention Wang Yi would have at least mentioned it in his pubic presser yesterday but he had bigger fish to fry.

The actual reality is that India is almost inconsequential to China and the differential in the two countries ability to project power is too vast now. China is literally just reminding GOI of that fact.

All this chest thumping and “we will take Azad Kashmir” rhetoric by the Indian army and government is causing uncertainty for Chinese projects in Gilgit Baltistan.

How do you fix that? You place 10k troops in a region barely manned by India and divert their 900k deployment on the Pakistani border to that side. You also get Nepal to stir up a border dispute and further thin out deployments on each front.

The Indian military’s two-front war strategy is almost comically dumb.

India is obsessed with China. China doesn't even notice India nor do most Chinese citizens care about India. It's a weird situation.

 

[StormBreaker]

@Dil Pakistan