J-10B - Information

[gambit]

...I do not understand why people have trouble accepting J-10B as a good product...

We never said the J-10 series is a 'poor' product. If it is good enough for enough people, then it is a good product. The issue is when you start a COMPARISON, which by itself is nothing wrong and enjoyable to make, but then people start to make judgments as to its supposedly 'superiority' to a known standard.

 

[amalakas]

...................

I was under the impression the J-10 used a version of the RD-30 (?) or something.
still with 125Kn is still less than the 140+ of the F-16 versions.

and I wouldn't trust the chinese engine ratings up to the point they have been exported to another country and verified.

I think your question can be easily answered.

I don't knock the J-10(a or b) down, I don't much care to be honest, to me this is a hobby nowdays.
all I am saying is, that on one hand we have a fighter series with lineage. On the other hand we have a plane which is out for only a few years, and then it is being redesigned to a new version.

Western aviation history (more open) has shown that redesigns usually address shortcomings in the original design apparent during use.

so in my eyes, until data surfaces that says otherwise, the J-10B is a fix on the J-10A.

as far as the DSI goes, I mentioned before, the chinese figured out hot to calculate the DSI parameters and apply it to everything these days.

In my eyes it is a weight saving measure and nothing more.

as far as Pak. trying to line up to get J-10s.. well ..politics, don't think there is anything else behind that.

 

[conworldus]

I think most F-16 versions use GE F110 which produces about 120kn thrust with a thrust to weight ratio of 6.5

The WS-10 has 132 KN thrust and a thrust to weight ratio of 7.5

The only Russian engine in Chinese service is the AL-31 and China imports them as replacement engine for existing fighters.

The J-10B is not a redesign. The J-10A entered service in 2005, and 7 year later we come out with a variant. That's pretty normal time period for a variant.

I was under the impression the J-10 used a version of the RD-30 (?) or something.
still with 125Kn is still less than the 140+ of the F-16 versions.

and I wouldn't trust the chinese engine ratings up to the point they have been exported to another country and verified.

I think your question can be easily answered.

I don't knock the J-10(a or b) down, I don't much care to be honest, to me this is a hobby nowdays.
all I am saying is, that on one hand we have a fighter series with lineage. On the other hand we have a plane which is out for only a few years, and then it is being redesigned to a new version.

Western aviation history (more open) has shown that redesigns usually address shortcomings in the original design apparent during use.

so in my eyes, until data surfaces that says otherwise, the J-10B is a fix on the J-10A.

as far as the DSI goes, I mentioned before, the chinese figured out hot to calculate the DSI parameters and apply it to everything these days.

In my eyes it is a weight saving measure and nothing more.

as far as Pak. trying to line up to get J-10s.. well ..politics, don't think there is anything else behind that.

 

[amalakas]

I think most F-16 versions use GE F110 which produces about 120kn thrust with a thrust to weight ratio of 6.5

The WS-10 has 132 KN thrust and a thrust to weight ratio of 7.5

The only Russian engine in Chinese service is the AL-31 and China imports them as replacement engine for existing fighters.

The J-10B is not a redesign. The J-10A entered service in 2005, and 7 year later we come out with a variant. That's pretty normal time period for a variant.

you mean the engine twr?

the F-16 has about 125-144kn of thrust depending on the engine version.
This is verified by users around the world.

the ws-10.. maybe ..but we don't know.. that is the thing.

 

[kafumanpk]

It exports? Who will buy it.

 

[conworldus]

Could you please kindly remind me which F-16 version has 144kn thrust? Because I haven't heard of any.

you mean the engine twr?

the F-16 has about 125-144kn of thrust depending on the engine version.
This is verified by users around the world.

the ws-10.. maybe ..but we don't know.. that is the thing.

 

[SyedF]

Could you please kindly remind me which F-16 version has 144kn thrust? Because I haven't heard of any.

F16 E/F Block 60 is powered by General Electrics F110-132

GE Delivers First F110-132 Engine

F16GE continues to deliver to Lockheed Martin F110-GE-132 engines, the highest-thrust fighter engine ever developed for the F-16 aircraft.

The F110-GE-132, which can produce up to 32,500 pounds of thrust (144 kN), is derived from GE's highly successful F110 engine family, which powers the majority of F-16C/Ds worldwide. The F110-GE-132 engine development was launched in 2000 with its selection for 80 Lockheed Martin F-16E/F aircraft by the United Arab Emirates (UAE) Air Force and Air Defense.

In June 2003, Lockheed Martin completed engine flight tests of the F110-GE-132 with a test bed F-16 aircraft at Edwards Air Force Base, California. Flight test of the F-16E/F aircraft, powered by the F110-GE-132 started in late 2003 in Fort. Worth, Texas.

The F110-GE-132 takes advantage of GE's extensive technology base, including: a long-chord-blisk fan derived from the F118 engine (for the U.S. Air Force B-2 Bomber) and F414 engine (U.S. Navy F/A-18E/F), a radial afterburner derived from the Joint Strike Fighter F136 engine and F414 engine, and a composite outer fan duct on the GE F404/F414 engines.


http://www.geaviation.com/engines/military/f110/spotlight_lockheed.html

 

[DrSomnath999]

Well take this into account... The J-10B's AESA is said to have 1200 T/R modules and LPI features...
Next the Radomme should be larger than the JF-17's... therefore larger then even the Eurofighter's Captor, further justification of this view is the larger nose made to accommodate DSI. Not to mention it will have an outstanding power output to go along with it...Please mate, if you'd like to learn about AESA or other radars, please just ask, don't talk about things you don't understand.

j10b doesnt has aesa radar yet but it is PESA ,it has been also posted in this forum also

Recently, a few photos of J-10B fighter’s radar array in Chinese websites exposed. Users analysis think that the pictures shows the J-10B’s radar is a passive phased array radar (PESA). PESA radar usually the middle of a row or rows of IFF antenna. The Active Phased Array Radar (AESA) has not yet seen the middle of this line is a flat surface without protrusion, so some users believe that the yellow radar map the surface of the black dots array for the IFF actual antenna, which fire control radar is to determine whether to adopt active phased array main indicator of high-tech.
J-10B fighter’s passive phased array radar exposured | WAREYE
Chinese Phased Array Radar For Fighter Jet ~ Chinese Military Review
http://www.defence.pk/forums/china-defence/109399-j-10b-aesa-pesa-radar.html

now see the pics of AESA radar they dont have any probes

My estimates are that the J-10B will outclass even the F-16Block 60/IN. Please prove me wrong if you can!

hhhmmmmm but can u prove that u are right on this

 

[conworldus]

AESA/PESA has nothing to do with IFF Antenna...

j10b doesnt has aesa radar yet but it is PESA ,it has been also posted in this forum also

now see the pics of AESA radar they dont have any probes

hhhmmmmm but can u prove that u are right on this

 

[DrSomnath999]

AESA/PESA has nothing to do with IFF Antenna...

oh really are u so sure about it

 

[conworldus]

oh really are u so sure about it

If you know anything about the difference between AESA and PESA, you should know that the IFF antenna has nothing to do with it. In AESA, each unit is independent, whereas in PESA they work in groups. The IFF antenna has nothing to do with the difference.

 

[DrSomnath999]

If you know anything about the difference between AESA and PESA, you should know that the IFF antenna has nothing to do with it. In AESA, each unit is independent, whereas in PESA they work in groups. The IFF antenna has nothing to do with the difference.

well kindly show me any pics of AESA radar in this world which has those probes (antennae)

 

[Zabaniyah]

Here's a recent article:
Chinese Avionics Advances Ripple Throughout Asia - Defense News

I do not think AESA has been introduced yet in the PLAAF on large-scale, but it will certainly happen. And the J-10B will certainly have AESA, and so will the JF-17 Block II. Otherwise, what's the point in developing the J-10B?

AESA isn't that hard. Just takes a bit of time any money when installing on aircraft on a mass basis.

 

[DrSomnath999]

Here's a recent article:
Chinese Avionics Advances Ripple Throughout Asia - Defense News

I do not think AESA has been introduced yet in the PLAAF on large-scale, but it will certainly happen. And the J-10B will certainly have AESA, and so will the JF-17 Block II. Otherwise, what's the point in developing the J-10B?

AESA isn't that hard. Just takes a bit of time any money when installing on aircraft on a mass basis.

see the question is not about hard or easy to develop AESA radar ,the question is whether j10b radar which is shown above is
aesa or pesa ,i am not saying china cannot develop aesa radar

 

[Jungibaaz]

j10b doesnt has aesa radar yet but it is PESA ,it has been also posted in this forum also

now see the pics of AESA radar they dont have any probes

hhhmmmmm but can u prove that u are right on this

Passive Electronically Scanned Array (PESA) and the Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) are the same in terms of technology and how they work, Both AESA and PESA can steer their beams electronically through use of the Phase Shifter, so it can be made in a solid state configuration (without any moving parts).

There are differences in the Radio Frequency source.

AESA has lots of Radiating Elements, where each of them have their own Transmitter and Receiver Module, hence the Antenna (where all the modules are) becomes 'active'.

PESA uses Radio Frequency source that usually found in other types of Radar like Klystrons (linear beam vacuum tube), Magnetrons (high powered Vacuum tube) and Travelling Wave Tubes (TWT is used to amplify the Radio Frequency).

The antenna you see there are IFF antenna, it's presence has nothing to do with whether the radar is AESA or PESA.