India vehemently ratifies the two nation theory after 8 decades of denial.

[Sugarcane]

1. I don't oppose even Martians if they wish to party or form a party for that matter. It's just that if Muslims wish to have political party of their own and going so far as to name it Muslim, it send a strong message. The message that they are separate from the general public of India and their political aspirations can only be aptly conveyed and protected by a Muslim political party is undeniable.

1. Please tell me how many Hindu political parties are there in India which are named Hindu or Hindu dietry? So, should we apply same logic and consider that they send strong message to others that they are separate from others?

2. Regarding political aspiration and protection of rights, yes - Muslim League indeed was formed to raise voice of Muslims and protect their interests & rights. Still what's issue with it unless you think Muslims shouldn't have talked about their rights and accepted whatever majority decides for them.

Right from the beginning the ML followed a no collision course with the British - that is detaching itself almost entirely from the Movement for a Free India. I don't blame them - I for one can't find fault with someone who had their motives clear.

Indians always ignore the fact that for 25 years MAJ was member of congress and was considered as Ambassador of Hindu-Muslim unity and remained so until the effective power was in hands of British - but as soon as political power devolved and congress imposed superiority of Hindu majority, only than he realized that he can't protect the rights of his community in congress.

2. The second statement presupposes that if the Indian non Muslim leadership had followed a Congress style of appeasement, the ML could support an United India.

Thanks God - Congress of that time didn't played these tactics and entrapped Muslims, and today 360 million more Muslims would have been subjected to mere vote banks - But anyway, i don't know how you linked imposition of definition of Indian by majority over minority with Congress appeasement?

Besides, it is but natural that any Indian would have a bias for Indian religions. I fail to miss the dots.

Of-course - Hindus will be biased towards their religion and Muslims will be for their. But letting this bias to tilt policies towards Hinduism was not acceptable in Indian sub-continent where Muslim though was minority in term of %age but in term of numbers their population was more than many countries. On top of that Hinduism & Islam is two 100% opposite religion.

Also interesting is the fact that long before calling for a 'Hindu nation'(though this is fiction, there was no movement for a Hindu nation till 1940 at least)*, our Beloved Sir Illama Iqbal wrote about the need for an Islamic homeland - in contrast to simply a British free India for all. But it's easier to blame Hindus, I believe.

An other interesting fact is that same like MAJ who remained in congress and tried to unit Muslims & Hindus, Iqbal was also author of beloved poem "Saray Jahan se payara Hindustan hamara" - ever try to dig to find out what was happening in Indian in 30s & 40s which changed the mindset of Jinnah & Iqbal 180 degree? But yeah blaming Muslims for all evils is far easier.

@Joe Shearer will be able to provide a more detailed glimpse of the times. No offence intended.

You are calling a jelly young man who loves to bombard people with essay like posts and saying that no offense intended.

* The writings of Savarkar in captivity or Gowalkar in 1940 does have strong sentiments for a Hindu state, but there is no doubt that they never had the clout to gather even a minute fraction of the support that a Gandhi Nehru or Azad could garner. Let's give the credit where it is due. Even the Thule society had ideas. But a strong leader calling for a Direct Action Day or passing a resolution in Lahore is far different.

Yeah - And Muslim League was doing rallies of millions on next day of formation. DAD & Lahore resolution were revolt against majority dictatorship for rights - As someone said that minority status with all the safeguards but without share in power only amounts to Cinderella with trade union rights and radio in the kitchen but still below the stairs. And Muslims in numbers was not that much tiny community whom you could have simply ignored in arrogance of being majority.

 

[livingdead]

Plot twist: Narendra Modi converted to islam.

 

[Joe Shearer]

View attachment 30866

Today after 8 decades of self inflicted denial the Hindu majority of India have finally ratified the two nation theory for themselves, by themselves on the democratic ballot box without compulsion or coercion. A resounding victory for the Hindu nationalist leader Narendra Modi indeed is a new chapter in South Asian history. For his Hindu nation he represents a strong leader, for Muslims of India he remains the butcher of Gujarat with blood on his hands.

With his fundamental support coming from the right wing Hindu camp of the BJP being sufficient for such a victory, the BJP did not care about the Muslim vote for the first time ever. They were simply sidelined as no effective election campaign was mounted to attract the Muslim vote. This electoral segregation will have a deep imprint and strategic implications on Indian social makeup of the future. Since the Muslim vote is not included, their participation in an overwhelmingly BJP govt will cease to exist.

For Pakistan it marks the end of an ideological battle spanning 8 decades. This is a victory we must celebrate, as our historic pretext has dawned into the day of correctness and approval. Visionaries who coined the two nation theory saw this day coming 8 decades ago. Its because of their genius, connection to our past, hard work and sacrifices that we Pakistanis today see the dawn of a day which proved us 'historically right' from this side of the border. It also therefore proves that the struggle of our ancestors for independence was both historically correct and strategically right, henceforth the long treacherous journey, that has tested the Pakistani time and again, has been worth it.

What tomorrow holds for India's Muslim is unknown, though for us we can finally rest this debate and move on with our nation building, knowing that our struggle had been righteous despite the tact of Gandhi and Nehru in order to convince our forefathers to the contrary. Those who asked us for proofs and ridiculed us, themselves have democratically ratified the robustness and righteousness of our historic narrative.

Let it be a source of humility and confidence for the Pakistani, as those who conspired to mislead our march in the past, today find themselves marching willingly and proudly along a parallel route, the same route our ancestors had created. Today we can safely write this for the historians that the future of sub continent was shaped by none other than our ancestors.

"The truth can only be delayed"

Aeronaut.

I read your brilliant piece, @Aeronaut, and I wholly disagree with it. I haven't read the rest of the thread yet, but wish you to consider two pieces in rebuttal: one is a reaction to the happening, the other is a weak-minded amateur's attempt at analysis.

I have taken it upon myself to spread a positive word about today's electoral results among the minorities who may be apprehensive. I expected someone else to do it but then realized that no one like's sticking one's neck out and I have been one with neck stretched to the limit. I tested it by placing a message on Moderate Voice of Kashmir page and found some excellent responses.

What people have to realize is that there is a lot of difference between a campaign and subsequent governance. Every one tends to take utterances and gestures of a campaign quite literally. Many from the minority communities, especially the youth, have voted for Narender Modi. They too were apprehensive because for them it was all about testing the waters. I think this election is going to bring about a historic change in India. It may still take a little time for the minorities to come out of their mistrust and self doubts. For some one like me and many others who have had a cosmopolitan upbringing and exposure to a profession such as the Army there is never any apprehension. I always believe and say it aloud that the one thing a Pakistani citizen misses most is the opportunity to have friends and associates from different faiths. In India we take it for granted. We eat in each other's houses, see movies together and play games through childhood unmindful of the great education one is receiving in the process; the education of Tolerance and Acceptance. That needs to be taken into real life too. But there are many others who never get that chance and are brought up on a diet of exclusion; you cannot blame them; they have not been so fortunate. It is for society to infuse that confidence in them so that they too start believing in the delights of pluralism.

In my perception a new chapter has opened in India's history. It will be a a great chapter if the minorities shed their fears and participate whole heartedly in this fresh and very passionate turn towards nation building in which all of us have a role to play. Nation building does not mean building up a community or a segment; it is every one at the wheel. The benefits of progress everyone is looking to are bound to flow if a disciplined, stable and committed government comes at the Centre. In many years we at last have it. Let us not allow this opportunity to pass with mutual suspicions and lack of confidence. If you are a true and well meaning Indian shed the inhibitions you may have had during the election campaign and look forward to the positives of growth. Somehow India has forgotten the meaning of stability; with its return it will take a little time getting used to it. But I think we are in for an El Dorado. So be it.

. What do you have to add, if there is some space still left??

That we misread the mood of the electorate, and not in an obvious way. We thought the two big parties would decay, and that people would retreat into their narrowest defined identity. It looked as if people were regressing to being Dalit first, or Manuvadi first, or Muslim first, and so on. It looked as if the era of coalitions had come and that it would take decades for a strong consensus to emerge.

A couple of things went wrong with this. First, we did not understand that a new class had emerged, promoted by democracy, who wanted prosperity and growth, and who had been schooled by mass media and mass education to reach out for the good things of life. This class was never well understood; they are a sociological phenomenon, not a political one. They are the people who lay outside the charmed circle of the Macaulayite legacy, the circle within which the governance of the country was almost entirely concentrated, notwithstanding the varying demographics of the elected representation of the country. This new class is not 'U', it's non-'U', in Nancy Mitford parlance. But it is several times larger than the earlier ruling elite, it knows its mind, and it knows its rights. This is no longer a generation which can be told off and will go and hide somewhere; it stands up for its own rights.

The second thing is that we missed hearing their unused voices. Sure, we couldn't have heard it, but we missed it not saying what we had predicted it would say: Hindutva, akhand bharat, atoot ang and all that kind of stuff. Stuff and nonsense. They were not interested. They wanted growth, and they were willing to back whoever talked growth. And that is the truth of the matter.

 

[KingMamba]

Plot twist: Narendra Modi converted to islam.

Lmao imagine. His new name would be Nawaz Muhammad.

 

[Joe Shearer]

1. Please tell me how many Hindu political parties are there in India which are named Hindu or Hindu dietry? So, should we apply same logic and consider that they send strong message to others that they are separate from others?

OK, we give up. You name one.

 

[Sugarcane]

OK, we give up. You name one.

Jelly young man - Why give up. You can simply say that no Hindu political party exists in India.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Jelly young man - Why give up. You can simply say that no Hindu political party exists in India.

Not that fast.

This was your presumption:

Please tell me how many Hindu political parties are there in India which are named Hindu or Hindu dietry? So, should we apply same logic and consider that they send strong message to others that they are separate from others?

Please go ahead and tell us how many Hindu political parties "are there in India" which are named Hindu or Hindu dietry (sic). Or shut up.

 

[KingMamba]

This thread still exist?

What is this thread al about indeed?

Mental Mesturbation of a Senior Admin? Anything Else?

All ur so called allegations has been numerous tyms falsified. Still u guyz dont wanna undertand. Compulsive Disorder?

Just for some hint. I doubt any Pakistani will get the hint from this video but still lemme try.

Idk why you guys think we care about Indian Muslims? We only hope Indian Muslims carve India up is all.

 

[Sugarcane]

Please go ahead and tell us how many Hindu political parties "are there in India" which are named Hindu or Hindu dietry (sic). Or shut up.

Jelly - Question mark "?" is there for reason, as i really didn't knew that how many Hindu parties are there with Hindu name, but was sure that there will be 1 or 2 parties. Anyway this is the first result of search List of Hindu political parties - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[WAR-rior]

Idk why you guys think we care about Indian Muslims? We only hope Indian Muslims carve India up is all.

No we dont think any random thing. This is the STATEMENT u guyz comeup when cornered.

Our Webster talk bout 'Pakistan having good relations with Modi UNTIL Indian Muslims are treated well'. What does it mean to u? Anything different from normal translations of English? U have NO BUSINESS with matters pertaining to region which is across ur Eastern Border.

 

[KingMamba]

No we dont think any random thing. This is the STATEMENT u guyz comeup when cornered.

Our Webster talk bout 'Pakistan having good relations with Modi UNTIL Indian Muslims are treated well'. What does it mean to u? Anything different from normal translations of English? U have NO BUSINESS with matters pertaining to region which is across ur Eastern Border.

Sorry you cannot stop the Ummah love from some circles.

 

[shuntmaster]

Now I know why Pakistani's here are calling Modi a terrorist. Pakistani's are terrified of Modi.
There are dozens of threads, created by Pakistani's here, dedicated to Modi in the past few days.

The way the Pakistanis are using Modi to justify their countrys existance, I suppose they are soon going to name Modi as their 'Quid-e-Azam'..

 

[WAR-rior]

Sorry you cannot stop the Ummah love from some circles.

Arre Bhai. Ummah is good. But someone explicitly asks u to leave them alone coz they dont think Pakistan has the moral right of talking bout Muslims around coz Muslims themselves blow up each other. What Ummah we talking here? What has Pakistan done for the Ummah other than acts for personal benefits. Its hilarious to see Pakistan talking bout Indian Muslims but will become best friends with India irrespective of Indian Muslims state if Kashmir is solved as per Pakistan's call. What do u call this?

Matlab ka Ummah.

And worst thing is Webbie thinking on these line? What direction r we moving to?

 

[RAMPAGE]

Just for some hint. I doubt any Pakistani will get the hint from this video but still lemme try.

O Meray bholay baadshah !!! I've seen his brother threatening to carve out another Pakistan out of India. This guy was sitting right behind him on the stage.

Jaa kisi apnay jaisay ko ullu bana !!!

 

[WAR-rior]

O Meray bholay baadshah !!! I've seen his brother threatening to carve out another Pakistan out of India. This guy was sitting right behind him on the stage.

Ha Ha. A person who dont have acumen to read correct out of statements calling othes Bhola?

By da way such dialouges are common during elections in India. Only Pakistanis feel elated for such speeches and then backslapped by every Indian to show u guyz da reality. ie. STAY OUT OF OUR MATTERS. THE NOBODYS OF THE WORLD DONT HAVE RIGHTS TO SHOW POSTURES.