Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[MastanKhan]

Ok.......so these are the pilots who told the Indian Government not to eff with Pakistan through trying to get into a limited war, because of the scary experience of capabilities these guys had flying the -16 against the SU-30's in house?

I also heard that the Isreali -16's dominate every encounter, be it BVR or WVR simulation against Mirages and SU-30's. Israeli sources say that like the remainder of their experiences, they've maintained 1% loss against Indian top tier planes. Which is why India went to PakFa and Rafale. The SU's have yet to win a sizable engagement against the -16's.

On Singaporean pilots, these guys are, at best, like the Swedish Air-force, the got the nicer toys but don't have have any combat experience outside of NATO exercises since the WWII. So their flying of the -16 is like I'd drive a Ferrari, for fun only. But even in their case, the SU-30 hasn't been shown to "dominate" anything. The results are in -16's favor and sometime in SU's favor.

Clearly explains why the jump from the SU-30 to Rafale or a 5th Gen platform.

By the way, Pakistani pilots have flow from the Mig 29's, to SU-30's, Mirage 2000 and soon Rafales also as Egyptians are getting it. So both sides know everything about the other one's platforms. What is different and has kept India at bay, is the serious capability that the -16 offers and they still can't get to a constant 50% kill ratio, without losing a larger number of SU-30's!!!!



1) The UAE had Mirages and Pakisanis have flowing them in Combat Sorties during the second Gulf war in serious numbers!!!

2) PAF pilots have NOT only flown the SU-27 and SU-30 inside China only, they have ALSO flown these more than twice for a few weeks each inside Pakistan for exercises. For confidentiality and exercise's sake, the SU-30 was put on a far away FOB and was to act like an aggressor (Indo - Pak war scenario) , representing the "Red" force. And to counter it in exercises, the PAF used -16 alone, -16 with F-7 (larger numbers coming in from the Red force), the JFT alone, the JFT with F-7 (larger number coming in from the Red force).

3) If the Singaporeans and Isrealis are going to do everything for you, how about give them the plane and let them fight the PAF too . Its like Moma Isreali AF bird feeding the baby IAF bird, teaching the baby bird how to fly,find food and eat it !!!! And IF you are getting tactics down from the Singaporeans, only God help you. Singaporean pilots are like Swedish pilots, haven't seen a conflict for 3 generations of pilots and the best thing they can do, is to escort Russian planes on and off, or do exercises with NATO, limited to simulations only!!!! And you want these Singaporean pilots to teach you "Tactics"!!!

And that you can't win from the -16, even if you did these exercises for the next 10 years. Israeli's have maintained a 1% loss ratio against the Mirages and the SU-30's and thus, India's decision to go buy Rafale's and 5th gen from Russia. Speaks volume.

There is a reason WHY the "limited warfare" didn't happen as post 2002 was the prime time to involve Pakistan into it as they rarely even had BVR's back then. But the IAF didn't do it because these SAME pilots and exercises, have provided the real truth to the Indian leadership. If you want to attack Pakistan, be ready to lose 50-100 SU-30's and Mirages. And the COST of that, isn't digestible to the Indians. Not to mention the mockery a trying to be "soup-o-powa" would get out of this across the globe!!


And I hope I explained to you what I MEAN....double cheers mate

Hi,

I could not have put it nicer than how you have done it.

 

[Viper0011.]

Hi,

I could not have put it nicer than how you have done it.

Thank you. I've learned one thing writing posts, that the stupid IPad was really built for women to touch screen with their long nails. Not for posting on forums.

It eats many words due to screen touch sensitivity and my big fingers. It makes the writer look like he didn't pass the high school due to so many mistakes, which otherwise won't be there if I used a laptop. I guess I am buying a laptop soon or retiring from the PDF!!!!

 

[Omega007]

...and PAF has enough DACT training with the Flankers.........

Guru, i thought a ban would've sorted your mind out, but i guess, once an Indian, always an Indian.

Can't compare the situations m8!!

Stop with your ''mental masturbation''.....Neither Singaporean nor Israelies have had any training with Pakistani F 16 pilots...IAF will hardly know the tactics and training PAF Pilots employ...From PAF Pilots you should always expect surprises...

And what makes you think that PAF fighter pilots would be so much better than their Israeli or Singaporean counterparts??And when most of the future air battles are to be fought at BVR ranges,tactics become secondary anyway.It's the technical knowledge about your opponent's fighters which is the most important factor.

Ok.......so these are the pilots who told the Indian Government not to eff with Pakistan through trying to get into a limited war, because of the scary experience of capabilities these guys had flying the -16 against the SU-30's in house?

I also heard that the Isreali -16's dominate every encounter, be it BVR or WVR simulation against Mirages and SU-30's. Israeli sources say that like the remainder of their experiences, they've maintained 1% loss against Indian top tier planes. Which is why India went to PakFa and Rafale. The SU's have yet to win a sizable engagement against the -16's.

On Singaporean pilots, these guys are, at best, like the Swedish Air-force, the got the nicer toys but don't have have any combat experience outside of NATO exercises since the WWII. So their flying of the -16 is like I'd drive a Ferrari, for fun only. But even in their case, the SU-30 hasn't been shown to "dominate" anything. The results are in -16's favor and sometime in SU's favor.

Clearly explains why the jump from the SU-30 to Rafale or a 5th Gen platform.

By the way, Pakistani pilots have flow from the Mig 29's, to SU-30's, Mirage 2000 and soon Rafales also as Egyptians are getting it. So both sides know everything about the other one's platforms. What is different and has kept India at bay, is the serious capability that the -16 offers and they still can't get to a constant 50% kill ratio, without losing a larger number of SU-30's!!!!



1) The UAE had Mirages and Pakisanis have flowing them in Combat Sorties during the second Gulf war in serious numbers!!!

2) PAF pilots have NOT only flown the SU-27 and SU-30 inside China only, they have ALSO flown these more than twice for a few weeks each inside Pakistan for exercises. For confidentiality and exercise's sake, the SU-30 was put on a far away FOB and was to act like an aggressor (Indo - Pak war scenario) , representing the "Red" force. And to counter it in exercises, the PAF used -16 alone, -16 with F-7 (larger numbers coming in from the Red force), the JFT alone, the JFT with F-7 (larger number coming in from the Red force).

3) If the Singaporeans and Isrealis are going to do everything for you, how about give them the plane and let them fight the PAF too . Its like Moma Isreali AF bird feeding the baby IAF bird, teaching the baby bird how to fly,find food and eat it !!!! And IF you are getting tactics down from the Singaporeans, only God help you. Singaporean pilots are like Swedish pilots, haven't seen a conflict for 3 generations of pilots and the best thing they can do, is to escort Russian planes on and off, or do exercises with NATO, limited to simulations only!!!! And you want these Singaporean pilots to teach you "Tactics"!!!

And that you can't win from the -16, even if you did these exercises for the next 10 years. Israeli's have maintained a 1% loss ratio against the Mirages and the SU-30's and thus, India's decision to go buy Rafale's and 5th gen from Russia. Speaks volume.

There is a reason WHY the "limited warfare" didn't happen as post 2002 was the prime time to involve Pakistan into it as they rarely even had BVR's back then. But the IAF didn't do it because these SAME pilots and exercises, have provided the real truth to the Indian leadership. If you want to attack Pakistan, be ready to lose 50-100 SU-30's and Mirages. And the COST of that, isn't digestible to the Indians. Not to mention the mockery a trying to be "soup-o-powa" would get out of this across the globe!!


And I hope I explained to you what I MEAN....double cheers mate

Seriously man,change your flags!!
By the way,why do you think we will be engaging their air force on the air when we can destroy their air assets even before they can take off??All we have to do is to destroy their runways with tactical battle field missiles like K 15s and Prithvi 3s,armed with anti air strip munitions and then..............,but lets save this discussion for another time.

 

[araz]

Thank you. I've learned one thing writing posts, that the stupid IPad was really built for women to touch screen with their long nails. Not for posting on forums.

It eats many words due to screen touch sensitivity and my big fingers. It makes the writer look like he didn't pass the high school due to so many mistakes, which otherwise won't be there if I used a laptop. I guess I am buying a laptop soon or retiring from the PDF!!!!

Its a problem with all people using smart phones and tablets. My daughters have no problems typing at 80 words a minute and yet I struggle putting in 10. Anyways from experience just read your post before posting and edit it. That is the only solution. A sharpner for stubby fingers might not be a good solution

 

[Donatello]

Thank you. I've learned one thing writing posts, that the stupid IPad was really built for women to touch screen with their long nails. Not for posting on forums.

It eats many words due to screen touch sensitivity and my big fingers. It makes the writer look like he didn't pass the high school due to so many mistakes, which otherwise won't be there if I used a laptop. I guess I am buying a laptop soon or retiring from the PDF!!!!

Get iPad Pro and a keyboard. Will make you life much easier.

 

[MastanKhan]

Thank you. I've learned one thing writing posts, that the stupid IPad was really built for women to touch screen with their long nails. Not for posting on forums.

It eats many words due to screen touch sensitivity and my big fingers. It makes the writer look like he didn't pass the high school due to so many mistakes, which otherwise won't be there if I used a laptop. I guess I am buying a laptop soon or retiring from the PDF!!!!

Hi,

So---now you have two choices---either get a laptop----or go to the chinese lady in the nail shop---and get some plastic nails.

 

[Viper0011.]

Hi,

So---now you have two choices---either get a laptop----or go to the chinese lady in the nail shop---and get some plastic nails.

Laptop it is....

Get iPad Pro and a keyboard. Will make you life much easier.

I have a wireless KB that I bought with the IPad a while ago. But I keep the IPad with me without carrying a big office bag, casually in the car, just so I get all my e-mails and docs on them while I am on the go. So the KB, 99% of the time, is sitting in my office bag without a use. I need to change that or just get a laptop today.

A sharpner for stubby fingers might not be a good solution

I'd avoid it. If you every try it, let me know how it went

 

[MilSpec]

Hi,

I could not have put it nicer than how you have done it.

Off topic and with all due respect I think you have found the perfect member here... both posting their imagination of what happens in a combat/training exercises, as gospel of truth with zero references, or logic.

Ok.......so these are the pilots who told the Indian Government not to eff with Pakistan through trying to get into a limited war, because of the scary experience of capabilities these guys had flying the -16 against the SU-30's in house?

I also heard that the Isreali -16's dominate every encounter, be it BVR or WVR simulation against Mirages and SU-30's. Israeli sources say that like the remainder of their experiences, they've maintained 1% loss against Indian top tier planes. Which is why India went to PakFa and Rafale. The SU's have yet to win a sizable engagement against the -16's.

On Singaporean pilots, these guys are, at best, like the Swedish Air-force, the got the nicer toys but don't have have any combat experience outside of NATO exercises since the WWII. So their flying of the -16 is like I'd drive a Ferrari, for fun only. But even in their case, the SU-30 hasn't been shown to "dominate" anything. The results are in -16's favor and sometime in SU's favor.

Clearly explains why the jump from the SU-30 to Rafale or a 5th Gen platform.

By the way, Pakistani pilots have flow from the Mig 29's, to SU-30's, Mirage 2000 and soon Rafales also as Egyptians are getting it. So both sides know everything about the other one's platforms. What is different and has kept India at bay, is the serious capability that the -16 offers and they still can't get to a constant 50% kill ratio, without losing a larger number of SU-30's!!!!



1) The UAE had Mirages and Pakisanis have flowing them in Combat Sorties during the second Gulf war in serious numbers!!!

2) PAF pilots have NOT only flown the SU-27 and SU-30 inside China only, they have ALSO flown these more than twice for a few weeks each inside Pakistan for exercises. For confidentiality and exercise's sake, the SU-30 was put on a far away FOB and was to act like an aggressor (Indo - Pak war scenario) , representing the "Red" force. And to counter it in exercises, the PAF used -16 alone, -16 with F-7 (larger numbers coming in from the Red force), the JFT alone, the JFT with F-7 (larger number coming in from the Red force).

3) If the Singaporeans and Isrealis are going to do everything for you, how about give them the plane and let them fight the PAF too . Its like Moma Isreali AF bird feeding the baby IAF bird, teaching the baby bird how to fly,find food and eat it !!!! And IF you are getting tactics down from the Singaporeans, only God help you. Singaporean pilots are like Swedish pilots, haven't seen a conflict for 3 generations of pilots and the best thing they can do, is to escort Russian planes on and off, or do exercises with NATO, limited to simulations only!!!! And you want these Singaporean pilots to teach you "Tactics"!!!

And that you can't win from the -16, even if you did these exercises for the next 10 years. Israeli's have maintained a 1% loss ratio against the Mirages and the SU-30's and thus, India's decision to go buy Rafale's and 5th gen from Russia. Speaks volume.

There is a reason WHY the "limited warfare" didn't happen as post 2002 was the prime time to involve Pakistan into it as they rarely even had BVR's back then. But the IAF didn't do it because these SAME pilots and exercises, have provided the real truth to the Indian leadership. If you want to attack Pakistan, be ready to lose 50-100 SU-30's and Mirages. And the COST of that, isn't digestible to the Indians. Not to mention the mockery a trying to be "soup-o-powa" would get out of this across the globe!!


And I hope I explained to you what I MEAN....double cheers mate

Zero references, zero logic and traditional mental self pleasure...
Irrespective of the above your narrative show the naivety and lack of understanding of objectives of training exercises...

 

[Viper0011.]

Off topic and with all due respect I think you have found the perfect member here... both posting their imagination of what happens in a combat/training exercises, as gospel of truth with zero references, or logic.
Zero references, zero logic and traditional mental self pleasure...
Irrespective of the above your narrative show the naivety and lack of understanding of objectives of training exercises...

References and facts of learning tactics from Singapore and Israel were provided by various Indian members on here, in this thread. Some with pictures .

If you have connections in the Israeli AF, I'd ask you to VERIFY my content that they've maintained 1% loss ratio against the Indian SU-30s. Which is why, the NEW IAF Chief says "these SU's are freaking garbage in front of top American products" and he wants at-least 100 more Rafale's or EFT's. He said something along the lines of his speech yesteray or the day before. If these requirements haven't hit the Indian press, they will pretty soon.

The IAF needs 100 more jets as SU-30's "multi-role" ability and massive size hasn't proven its worth. Yet, it is a great plane but in the situation with block 52 and 60 of the -16, easy to lose.

So here, I gave you references, facts and PROOFs of your own people, media and IAF chief. What more can you ask for to credentialize a person or a post?????

 

[MilSpec]

References and facts of learning tactics from Singapore and Israel were provided by various Indian members on here, in this thread. Some with pictures .

If you have connections in the Israeli AF, I'd ask you to VERIFY my content that they've maintained 1% loss ratio against the Indian SU-30s. Which is why, the NEW IAF Chief says "these SU's are freaking garbage in front of top American products" and he wants at-least 100 more Rafale's or EFT's. He said something along the lines of his speech yesteray or the day before. If these requirements haven't hit the Indian press, they will pretty soon.

The IAF needs 100 more jets as SU-30's "multi-role" ability and massive size hasn't proven its worth. Yet, it is a great plane but in the situation with block 52 and 60 of the -16, easy to lose.

So here, I gave you references, facts and PROOFs of your own people, media and IAF chief. What more can you ask for to credentialize a person or a post?????

the only garbage is see is the verbiage above... lol... as expected.

 

[Viper0011.]

the only garbage is see is the verbiage above... lol... as expected.

No, I gave you the References, Facts and Proofs and majority of those are your Indian sources as described above, right on this thread and some being announced soon in your media (see I know what's coming out of the Indian media in the near future too MUAHAHAAHA).

And now, I handed it to you ONE more time and your post above shows me nothing but frustration and embarrassment!!! I feel sorry man, I really do,

 

[MilSpec]

No, I gave you the References, Facts and Proofs and majority of those are your Indian sources as described above, right on this thread and some being announced soon in your media (see I know what's coming out of the Indian media in the near future too MUAHAHAAHA).

And now, I handed it to you ONE more time and your post above shows me nothing but frustration and embarrassment!!! I feel sorry man, I really do,

I am just amazed at how dumb you are, do you even know what references and proof means... you really need a dictionary...

 

[Viper0011.]

I am just amazed at how dumb you are, do you even know what references and proof means... you really need a dictionary...

And I am just surprised to see how low IQ a nation of 1.2 billion people have. And yet are called "smart" when there is nothing smart or I haven't seen it. Ane xample are your posts, I embarrass you and prove you wrong ten times every week. But you don't get the hint.......where's the "smart Indian IQ" that you feed to the world that exists in India, coming down in the waters from Nepal that ONLY Indians drink, and therefore are smart people

Let it go. Like the US Army's slogan, you are dealing with "an Army of One" and you can't win!!

 

[MilSpec]

And I am just surprised to see how low IQ a nation of 1.2 billion people have. And yet are called "smart" when there is nothing smart or I haven't seen it. Ane xample are your posts, I embarrass you and prove you wrong ten times every week. But you don't get the hint.......where's the "smart Indian IQ" that you feed to the world that exists in India, coming down in the waters from Nepal that ONLY Indians drink, and therefore are smart people

Let it go. Like the US Army's slogan, you are dealing with "an Army of One" and you can't win!!

man, sorry did not mean to hurt your little ego....
I sympathize with your situation.
Only if you could show One, one single post where you have proven anything with an engagement with me. I will leave this forum right now... how bout that?

Delusional trolls like you are dime a a dozen here on the forum

 

[Viper0011.]

man, sorry did not mean to hurt your little ego....
I sympathize with your situation.

I don't have ego. Just facts and you fail to provide them, even with your 1.2 billion people. At the end, you have post like these or personal stuff to write. Which I am no longer going to write back to you on. When you write a post with facts, worth responding, I'll respond to it.