Over100 US air sorties confront over 300 Chinese air sorties in east China sea.

[huanghong]

A lot of trade secret was missing/overlooked when someone try to copy it

You don't need to compare really high tech stuff like jet engine. Even low tech stuff like a gas mask, you can see they didn't put a lot of effort into making a gas mask that suitable for the troop. I mean Gasmask essentially is a rubber mask with a filter, not much of a high tech component on them.

This is the PLA current gasmask called FMJ-08

View attachment 896590

Set aside the uncanny look of FMJ-08 to the British Avon S-10/FM-12 series mask, (Which is as old as I am)

View attachment 896592

This is not ergonomics....Anyone who wear a 2-hole gasmask (Or US M17 or M40, both of which I wore when I was in the Army) know you have zero situation awareness and you can't see shit at night because of the nose piece stuck out in the middle, which mean you have a tiny vision forward, yes, this may be what our eyes were located, but unlike our eyes, you don't have the curve of your eyeball, and not to mention the black plastic that is going to block your vision around the visual cone. This has been the feedback since 1980s when these mask were issued, and we fought in 1991 wearing M17, 2003 wearing M40 and that's probably the last straw and now we (US and NATO) moved on these and M50 we use have a one piece eyepiece which is the norm now, along with dual filter. Because you just can't breath with one, as that restrict your air flow.

View attachment 896591

Notice this is a very non-advance thing, which mean you don't need state of the art technology to make a respirator or gasmask, yet the Chinese design is seriously outdated to a point I would have imagine their troop would have issue fighting wearing those as much as we did back in 1990s and 2000s.

The gas masks used by pla in the past, fmj-08 belong to the inventory products that are still in use, and the FMJ-10 on the right is in line with your statement.

a one piece eyepiece which is the norm now, along with dual filter

 

[IblinI]

no doubt about the reliability of Chinese technology including their jet engines.
the only thing open for debate is the claim about how good or better they are compared to established Icons in the West.

Lower your expection then you will have suprises, common rules for everything.

Then u r quite outdated my friend ... Even chinese auto technology is doing very well and reliable and establishing market in Middle east and USA

Japanese is not doing so well lately in almost all industries, especially those emerging industry such as AI, Drones (be it military or civilian), auto especially EV, even their entertainment sector got smashed by SK except the last piece, manga.

 

[beijingwalker]

The gas masks used by pla in the past, fmj-08 belong to the inventory products that are still in use, and the FMJ-10 on the right is in line with your statement.View attachment 896595

a one piece eyepiece which is the norm now, along with dual filter
View attachment 896598

PLA gas masks

US can't even produce hazmat suits for their medical workers and ventilators for their covid patients, they totally depend on China on them

 

[beijingwalker]

A lot of trade secret was missing/overlooked when someone try to copy it

You don't need to compare really high tech stuff like jet engine. Even low tech stuff like a gas mask, you can see they didn't put a lot of effort into making a gas mask that suitable for the troop. I mean Gasmask essentially is a rubber mask with a filter, not much of a high tech component on them.

This is the PLA current gasmask called FMJ-08

I doubt that US can really produce gas masks at all, go and check online, every single product is from China

Shanghai, Xi'an, Guangzhou...

 

[jhungary]

I doubt that US can really produce gas masks at all, go and check online, every single product is from China

Shanghai, Xi'an, Guangzhou...

View attachment 896611

You can doubt whatever you want, that does not change any of the fact.

MSA Safety - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

3M - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On the other hand, if you can buy a "PLA Gasmask" for less than 40 bucks, if were you, I will really Pray for your Troop never to fight in a NBC environment. Those are costume mask or for painter or whatever...

 

[jhungary]

The gas masks used by pla in the past, fmj-08 belong to the inventory products that are still in use, and the FMJ-10 on the right is in line with your statement.View attachment 896595

a one piece eyepiece which is the norm now, along with dual filter
View attachment 896598

I think you failed to comprehend what I wrote.

My point is, China is copying other people, sure, you can copy other, but then you will not be able to break the innovation cycle because that "Norm" you are also copying from the West. By the time Chinese have FMJ-10, the US already had 2 different generation of gasmask (MCU-2 and M50) that was using the same tech. And then that also beg the question, why they are still making FMJ-08 in 2008??

While this norm in gasmask, not an extremely difficult nor advance technology, why the Chinese still can't break that same cycle, like jet engine @Hamartia Antidote mentioned or Z-20 chopper I have mentioned? The "Breakthru" should have been seeing from a long way away. I mean this is not some complicated science you need time to break thru, you use it, you wear it, and you will instantly know that was shit. Yet, they are still trailing the west on Gas Mask design.

That's my point, my point is not Chinese can't or don't have the capability to make a dual port single visor mask. Of course they can make it, how hard can it be? What I was referring to is the "Jump" from single port and two eyepieces to Single Visor dual port.

 

[beijingwalker]

On the other hand, if you can buy a "PLA Gasmask" for less than 40 bucks, if were you, I will really Pray for your Troop never to fight in a NBC environment. Those are costume mask or for painter or whatever...

The most gas mask online were made in China and China equips its troops with the best gears now, you should pray for US troops, they are even running out of ammos, during the early stage of the pandemic, their doctors and nurses had to wear trashbags and covid patients died like flies for lacking ventilators, which are mainly made in China.
A pademic can strain US supplies this much, think about a war.

US accused of 'modern piracy' after diversion of masks meant for Europe

German politician adds to chorus of complaints about American tactics to source protective gear

www.theguardian.com

 

[jhungary]

The most gas mask online were made in China and China equipped its troops with the best gears, you should pray for US troops, they are even running out of ammos, during the early stage of the pandemic, their doctors and nurses had to wear trashbags and covid patients died like flies for lacking ventilators, which are mainly made in China.
A pademic can strain US supplies this much, think about a war.

US accused of 'modern piracy' after diversion of masks meant for Europe

German politician adds to chorus of complaints about American tactics to source protective gear

www.theguardian.com

COVID is NOT Airborne disease......it's really pointless to wear gasmask, surgical mask for barrier protection maybe. If the Army start fighting NBC war in surgical mask, then I will let you know.

and I am not the one who type "Military Gasmask" online and then proceed to tell me these mask less than $30 is indeed "Military Gasmask" we use, I mean if you believe that is the mask any military, including yours will use, again, that's not my problem.

 

[beijingwalker]

COVID is NOT Airborne disease......it's really pointless to wear gasmask, surgical mask for barrier protection maybe. If the Army start fighting NBC war in surgical mask, then I will let you know.

and I am not the one who type "Military Gasmask" online and then proceed to tell me these mask less than $30 is indeed "Military Gasmask" we use, I mean if you believe that is the mask any military, including yours will use, again, that's not my problem.

Since they can't produce surgical masks and ventilators, what made you sure they are able to produce enough other gears? it all boils down to a country's overal industrial and manuufacturing might, which US has almost none left, now they are even running out of ammos.

 

[Beast]

now you going to list me accidents and failures? like I said there are always exceptions to the rule. Space Shuttle was ahead of its time.
it made so many missions successfully speaks of the ingenuity and technical prowess of Western engineers and scientists its a shame that such tragedies happened but the causes were found and lessons learned. even the F22 initially met accident but now its the undisputed father of all jet fighters and can make any rival airforce its bitch... wait why am I even debating that.

And yet US abandon it. The concept is nothing but boast the ego of US only. It is achieved at the expense of all cost.

China learn thru the lesson of Soviet Union and USA. Such method of dumping money to achieve something is not feasible in long run. And you think China can't build a space shuttle? Do u know just a single launch of this shuttle cost how much?

US might have even colonised moon by now if fund and project are better managed instead of these expensive white elephant projects.

Then u r quite outdated my friend ... Even chinese auto technology is doing very well and reliable and establishing market in Middle east and USA

 

[jhungary]

Since they can't produce surgical masks and ventilators, what made you sure they are able to produce enough other gears? it all boils down to a country's overal industrial and manuufacturing might, which US has almost none left, now they are even running out of ammos.

Who tell you they can't produce surgical mask and ventilators?

You do know the biggest Medical Ventilator company was in the US, right, and at the onset of COVID, China is the one that begging the US for mask and ventilator.

TOP 10 COMPANIES IN VENTILATORS MARKET

The Ventilators Market is expected to reach USD 7.72 billion by 2027, at a CAGR of 15.8% during the forecast period of 2020 to 2027. Ventilatory intervention is often life-saving when patients with asthma or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) experience acute respiratory compromise...

meticulousblog.org

Not a single Chinese company are in the leading 10 company, I am pretty sure some Chinese Hospital are using Becton and Dickson in their hospital.

And lol, the reason why US ran out of mask is because we send China almost all our surgical mask stock in place...that's not a manufacture problem, that's just stupidity. We should not have done so, we should not have supplies China these mask and let you people died..

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/us-sent-millions-of-face-masks-to-china-early-this-year-ignoring-pandemic-warning-signs/2020/04/18/aaccf54a-7ff5-11ea-8013-1b6da0e4a2b7_story.html

 

[beijingwalker]

China gives 1.4 billion Chinese daily covid test, meaning billions of test kits spent every single day, which country is nearly able pull this off? In worst case scenario, China can give every single Chinese a gas mask, can US possilbe do this?

Who tell you they can't produce surgical mask and ventilators?

You do know the biggest Medical Ventilator company was in the US, right, and at the onset of COVID, China is the one that begging the US for mask and ventilator.

TOP 10 COMPANIES IN VENTILATORS MARKET

The Ventilators Market is expected to reach USD 7.72 billion by 2027, at a CAGR of 15.8% during the forecast period of 2020 to 2027. Ventilatory intervention is often life-saving when patients with asthma or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) experience acute respiratory compromise...

meticulousblog.org

Not a single Chinese company are in the leading 10 company, I am pretty sure some Chinese Hospital are using Becton and Dickson in their hospital.

And lol, the reason why US ran out of mask is because we send China almost all our surgical mask stock in place...that's not a manufacture problem, that's just stupidity. We should not have done so.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/us-sent-millions-of-face-masks-to-china-early-this-year-ignoring-pandemic-warning-signs/2020/04/18/aaccf54a-7ff5-11ea-8013-1b6da0e4a2b7_story.html

They have those big companies, yes, but products are made in China, this is why China didn't have ventilator problem and US does, see the difference? in emergency situations, company names mean nothing, where facturies are means everything.

 

[jhungary]

China gives 1.4 billion Chinese daily covid test, meaning billions of test kits spent every single day, which country is nearly able pull this off? In worst case scenario, China can give every single Chinese a gas mask, can US possilbe do this?

No country can pull this off, because no one have a 1.4 billion population.

And US have more gasmask than its entire population. We have civil defense, you know, we don't need to "Produce" anything, the number are already there.

By the way, US have 1 billion test for 330 millions resident at the height of COVID.

They have those big companies, yes, but products are made in China, this is why China didn't have ventilator problem and US does, see the difference? in emergency situations, company names mean nothing, where facturies are means everything.

Are you stupid or crazy or both?? Not everything is produced in China. BD produce their ventilator in the US (Tuscon), they don't have factory in China.

New Manufacturing Plants Announced in April 2021 - IndustrySelect®

This article provides a roundup and overview of new U.S. manufacturing companies and expansions that were announced in April 2021.

industryselect.com

On the other hand, BD produce 96% of the world syringe in the US, that supply to China, I want to see how Chinese Hospital do without BD syringe......

 

[beijingwalker]

Who tell you they can't produce surgical mask and ventilators?

Of course you can, US doctors are very versatile and can do many jobs

 

[jhungary]

Of course you can, US doctors are very versatile and can do many jobs

Again, that's because you China bitch to US about sending PPE and Mask to help with COVID and we send those PPE and Mask to you and making ourselves vulnerable.

China "Urgently Needs" Medical Masks, Other Equipment To Tackle Coronavirus

China said Monday it "urgently needs" protective medical equipment as the death toll in the country from a highly contagious coronavirus passed that of the 2002 SARS crisis, with more than 17,000 infected.

www.ndtv.com

Should have just let you people died.