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India, US set to finalise aircraft carrier technology agreement

Not sure if larger reactors are easier or not.
However my point discusses a what if scenario where US offers a take it or leave it package of EMALS,F 35 C,E 3 sentry AWCS and GE gas turbines.
This is the most likely scenario.

Yes.. Larger Reactors are easier to build than a miniature ones. since the time Navy planned to go for Nuke carrier BARC is working on a larger reactor along with 120 to 130MW reactor for SSN.

I've been telling this for Months... If EMALS then Yes We'll have to buy F-35 along with it..anyhow navy is already interested in F-35C. Sentry and GE are Optional. although we're more likely to see sentry in IN's hands since no other good carrier based AWACS available.
 
So is N-FGFA.
At least there are six PAK-FA's today. That's a start. What do we have with AMCA? ASQR's?
As of now even configuration of N-FGFA ,if there would be any, is not decided. Even this is not clear as to whether Russia would go for Naval version of FGFA or build a new plane (probably from Mig) from scratch, or whether it would go for a fight gen carrier capable plane , or keep on fielding Mig-29K's from its Aircraft carriers.

N-FGFA being inducted into service in any Navy in next decade would be as big a miracle as AMCA getting inducted in IAF in next decade.
Why so? If we pen down the deal for FGFA this year or next then development shouldn't take more than 10 years max.
The weakness of Russia resulting from crashing prices of Oil would make them incrementally more dependent on China.

And today if a Nixon pop out ,it would be party time for India. Geopolitical situation has changed. Today China is a rival of USA and if USA does not contain it, China would destroy their hegemony, and because of China being "not so friendly" country to India, our interest converge with USA ATM (pretty much like how USSR was rival in cold war era ,and China due to its problem with USSR become a temporary ally of USA).

A hawk like Nixon would serve India well. In recent memory, G.W. Bush was best US president from Indian POV.
I meant Nixon as a fool, not hawk. At any rate, PRODUCING N-FGFA with full control over spares, source codes and frequencies is far better option BUYING Faltu-35 with EUMA which is basically stuffed with open-sourced stuff because we didn't sign in CISMOA to get the 'ally-grade' stuff.
 
I am more interested to know the "strings" attached with this......

Uncle sam is too smart.... to share a technology like this one......
 
Bhai sahab, we doesnt have single hull technology.
This is simple as that, and if we want to manufacture single hull SSN, we need European help. And only French is viable option.

Is it so????

This is for you:

Unravelling a Cold War Mystery

The ALFA SSN: Challenging Paradigms, Finding New Truths, 1969–79

Gerhardt Thamm

This article originally appeared in a classified Studies in Intelligence, Vol. 37 No. 3 (Fall 1993). The author received a Studies in Intelligence Annual Award for it in 1994. The article was declassified with slight redactions in 2007.

We knew that the Soviets did not follow our practice in building submarines; they did not incorporate edge-of-technology items in series-production models.

Better is the enemy of good enough.

This Russian proverb incorporates a philosophy that is both wise and true to the Russian heart. Those who have learned to appreciate the Russian character will agree that most Russians instinctively adhere to and follow that philosophy. To build, to create things good enough to do what they are meant to do is wise; to make them better than necessary is a waste of energy and precious resources. The proverb reportedly was inscribed on a plaque in the office of Deputy Minister of Defense and Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Sergei Gorshkov, who had guided the development of his navy since 1956.

Those of us who watched the building of the Soviet Navy from its humble beginnings as a coastal defense force after World War II to a powerful bluewater navy noticed long ago that the old proverb was true, even when it came to building submarines.

We knew that the Soviets did not follow our practice in building submarines; they did not incorporate edge-of-technology items in series-production models. And we saw Soviets building double-hull submarines long after we had discovered that the modern single-hull design had many advantages over the double hull, among them an improved speed/horsepower ratio. While the US Navy leaped decades ahead in submarine design, the Soviets plodded along by improving tried technologies. Our submarines not only looked better, they were better.

Yet the Soviets seemed satisfied with evolutionary advances in submarine design. Many US intelligence analysts were sure that the Soviets were never going to “put all their eggs into one basket.” Soviet society punishes failure; designing high-risk submarines does not enhance one's career.

It took infinite patience to fit this miscellany into the ALFA assessment. Although it was a difficult challenge, it was a task in which most intelligence analysts excel.


Phase One

This was the consensus of Western intelligence analysts, at least until one pleasant day in 1969 when strollers walking along the Neva River saw a modern-looking, small submarine tied up at the fitting-out quay at Leningrad’s old Sudomekh Submarine Shipyard. It looked as if the submarine had just been launched from the old diesel submarine assembly shed. The assembly shed had seen little activity since the last Foxtrot-class diesel attack submarine had been launched there several years earlier. Naval analysts, following tradition and basing their analysis on previous launch histories, initially classified the submarine as a modern diesel-electric follow-on to a Foxtrot.

Further fitting-out activity, however, soon convinced at least one senior submarine analyst, Herb Lord, that this submarine was an SSN, a nuclear-powered attack submarine. It had a superbly streamlined hull and an overall length of about 79 meters.[1] Engineering calculations gave it a surfaced displacement of some 2,600 tons,[2] with a submerged displacement of about 3,700 tons.[3] Aside from the exceptionally streamlined hull form, this submarine had several other highly unusual features:

· In 1969, it was the world's smallest SSN.

· It had, a rather high reserve buoyancy—a safety factor—of nearly 30 percent, in contrast to 8 to 11 percent for US SSNs.

The submarine received the NATO classification ALFA Class SSN. Lord, an experienced photointerpreter, alerted others to concentrate their efforts on the ALFA’s construction and fitting-out pattern. The analysts noticed something they had never seen be- fore, a “highly reflective” pressure hull section near the ALFA assembly area.

Lord then requested that he be point of contact for all reports that mentioned “highly reflective” or unusually colored submarine parts. During some eight years of examining photos of Soviet submarine construction yards, analysts assembled a construction history of a magnitude never before accomplished.

Periodically, and with ever increasing frequency, Lord received reports of “highly reflective” pressure hull sections associated with the ALFA fitting out at Sudomekh. Later, he also received reports of highly reflective pieces of hull sections, similar to those of the Sudomekh ALFA, at the Severodvinsk Submarine Construction Yard, far to the north of Leningrad.[4] He noted that these two yards were connected by an inland waterway, and he wondered whether both yards could be building this rather unusual class of attack submarine.

Lord subsequently conducted what is generally known as “look-back” analysis. All reports of “highly reflective” submarine hull sections at the two construction sites were collated, reviewed, and once again evaluated. It was a formidable, time consuming task. There were reports of changes to the external appearance of the assembly halls; reports dealing with unusual submarine parts at storage sites near the halls; and reports on unusual railroad cars, tank cars, and increased production of titanium sponge. All were scrutinized. It took infinite patience to fit this miscellany into the ALFA submarine assessment. Although it was a most difficult challenge, it was a task in which most intelligence analysts excel.

After reviewing all the evidence and after long discussions with his fellow intelligence analysts, and with naval designers, engineers, and others in the Intelligence Community, Lord became even more convinced that the Soviets were indeed building a “special” type of super submarine, the first made of titanium alloy. Eventually, he concluded that he had to convince the US Navy that the Soviets were series-producing a highly modern, unusual SSN that, if fitted with advanced weapons, could seriously threaten US and allied naval operations.

Some analysts at CIA and the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) agreed. In fact. CIA had, as early as 1971, published analysis—Use of Titanium by the Soviet Shipbuilding Industry—that strongly supported the assessment that the otherwise conservative Soviets had conducted serious, long-time research on shaping and welding heavy titanium plates, and that they had in fact developed that capability.


Lord tired to prove that the Soviets had moved from their usual submarine building methods, and that they had combined several advanced technologies in a single class of submarine.

Others were skeptical. They thought that the shaping and welding of heavy titanium hull sections, especially in the generally “dirty” shipyard atmosphere, was impractical, if not impossible. This, too, was a totally reasonable assessment, because titanium cannot be welded when exposed to air; welds have to be shielded, usually by argon gas. The consensus was that the Soviets could weld small parts of titanium, such as those for aircraft or missiles, in hermetically sealed chambers, but that it was impossible to weld huge submarine pressure hull sections.

Lord, however, could not be deterred. For nine years, he would be in the center of the battle over the “titanium submarine.” During the early 1960s, little reliable, high-level scientific and technical information was available, and Lord had to rely heavily on photographic intelligence.

Lord remained certain that the collective evidence overwhelmingly supported his assessment of ALFA’s titanium alloy pressure hull. He tried to convince the US Navy that the Soviets” research and development had advanced to such a degree that they were able to build submarines made of light-weight titanium alloy, and that their SSN would be able to dive deeper than any of our SSNs. In addition, a nonmagnetic titanium submarine would be most difficult to detect.

He tried to prove that the Soviets had moved from their usual submarine building methods, and that they had combined several advanced technologies in a single class of submarine:

· A highly advanced, and possibly risky, pressure hull material (titanium alloy).

· An as-yet unknown, high-density nuclear power plant (high power concentration in a small hull).

· Possible automation to reduce the size of the crew.

It was an entirely unbelievable story.

The assessment was critical for US ship, submarine, and underwater sensor and weapon designers. After almost eight years of debate with Navy decisionmakers, Lord retired. He died a few years later, his enormous research effort never properly recognized by Naval Intelligence.

Phase Two

In a functional reorganization in Naval Intelligence the analysis of foreign submarines was divided into ballistic and cruise missile submarines, and attack diesel and nuclear attack submarines. The attack submarines were my responsibility, and in 1978 I became the ALFA Project Officer.

I agreed completely with Lord’s analysis. Now it became my mission to convince the US Navy that the Soviets were building high-threat submarines using advanced construction technology. Also in 1978, CIA sponsored a meeting of intelligence analysts, naval engineers, metallurgists, and submarine designers to discuss the “enigma” in Soviet submarine construction.

The US submarine community could not accept any possibility that the Soviets could series-produce such a sophisticated submarine.

The great majority agreed that the “highly reflective” parts were submarine components. Most were certain that the components were not of conventional submarine steel. One expert presented several dozen formulae collected from published matter freely available to any serious researcher. He believed these open sources proved conclusively that titanium alloys dissolve in sea water. There were a few who suggested the whole “Sudomekh show” could have been a large-scale “disinformation” program, and that the highly reflective components were just parts covered with aluminum paint.

Many leading metallurgists still believed it probably was impossible for the Soviets to have developed the capability to bend, shape, and weld thick titanium plates in a shipyard environment. The US submarine community, “the Rickover people,” was happy with this assessment. It could not accept any possibility that the Soviets could series-produce such a sophisticated submarine.

These expert opinions made the ALFA submarine assessment inconclusive. On the one hand, I had the expert naysayers; on the other, I had some admirals asking, “What the hell are the Russians doing?”

Lord had rejected aluminum, stainless steel, and glass fibers. There remained the HY80, HY 100, or possibly HY130 steels, and titanium. Except for stainless steel—steel turns a dark, almost black color when exposed to the elements for extended periods. I still agreed with Lord’s analysis that a titanium alloy was the most logical material suitable for submarine pressure hulls.

As analysis continued, I perceived five essential problem areas, which I called “enigmas.” These made life difficult because they challenged traditional beliefs about the very nature of Soviet submarine construction.

· First Enigma: An apparent change in Soviet design and construction methodology.

Advantage: Long-range gain.

Disadvantage: Large investment of resources.

Remarks: If successful, Soviet submarine designers and builders were making a quantum leap into modern technology.

· Second Enigma: Use of titanium alloy in pressure hull construction.

Advantage: Titanium is stronger and weighs 33 percent less than steel; the pressure hull can be stronger without increasing displacement; its use gives a submarine a stronger hull for greater diving depth and increases resistance to explosives at lesser depths; and the submarine is essentially nonmagnetic, thus decreasing the likelihood of magnetic anomaly detection (MAD).

Disadvantage: Titanium is three to five times more expensive than steel; it needs a totally different manufacturing process; shipyard workers must be retrained; construction halls must be reconfigured; and bending and shaping of heavy plates of titanium alloy are far more difficult compared to steel.

Remarks: Much evidence had been gathered that the Soviet Navy had ample research and development funds and that Soviet metallurgists had made remarkable advances in titanium manufacturing technology. Reports indicated that the Soviet Navy had conducted research in HY 100 steel, aluminum, glass fiber, and titanium alloys for use in ship and submarine construction.

· Third Enigma: Apparent use of liquid metal reactor coolants.

Advantage: Better horsepower to weight/volume ratio for higher speed.

Disadvantage: The US Navy believed that a reactor cooled by liquid metal is less safe than the pressurized water reactor (PWR) in use by the US Navy.

Remarks: The US Navy’s safety record supported the PWR approach.

· Fourth Enigma: Seemingly large-scale use of automation and reduction of crew size.

Advantage: Reduced the size of the boat and the size of its crew; lessened demand for electric power requirements; and relieved crew from mundane tasks, thus eliminating human errors caused by fatigue and boredom.

Disadvantage: The US Navy believed automated controls to be less safe than hands-on control functions.

Remarks: Only by automating many control functions could the Soviets reduce the size of the submarine. This increased the ALFA’s survivability in combat, because it became a smaller active-sonar target. Furthermore, the low magnetic signature from a nonmagnetic titanium hull made localization of target by MAD difficult. Having unmanned engineering spaces also reduced personnel casualties should the liquid metal reactor malfunction.

· Fifth Enigma: Large rescue sphere in ALFA sail indicative of strong concern for crew survivability.

Advantage: Provides safe exit for entire crew from maximum depth without external assistance. When the sphere is on the surface, it becomes a lifeboat; it protects the crew from the elements; and it has sufficient communications, emergency rations, and first aid on board.

Disadvantage: Increases weight of the submarine.

Remarks: The ALFA’s high reserve buoyancy, as well as a sophisticated rescue system, implied Soviet Navy concern for crew survivability. There were other indicators: the Soviet Navy had one India class submarine rescue submarine each in Northern and Pacific fleet areas, had several “hard” compartments in submarines, and now had fitted a sophisticated survival system in the ALFA. This was another item that did not square with our view that the Soviets had little concern for human life.

I believed that different collection assets had to be activated to convince the US Navy of a serious threat to our submarines.
 
Is it so????

This is for you:

Unravelling a Cold War Mystery

The ALFA SSN: Challenging Paradigms, Finding New Truths, 1969–79

Gerhardt Thamm

This article originally appeared in a classified Studies in Intelligence, Vol. 37 No. 3 (Fall 1993). The author received a Studies in Intelligence Annual Award for it in 1994. The article was declassified with slight redactions in 2007.

We knew that the Soviets did not follow our practice in building submarines; they did not incorporate edge-of-technology items in series-production models.

Better is the enemy of good enough.

This Russian proverb incorporates a philosophy that is both wise and true to the Russian heart. Those who have learned to appreciate the Russian character will agree that most Russians instinctively adhere to and follow that philosophy. To build, to create things good enough to do what they are meant to do is wise; to make them better than necessary is a waste of energy and precious resources. The proverb reportedly was inscribed on a plaque in the office of Deputy Minister of Defense and Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Sergei Gorshkov, who had guided the development of his navy since 1956.

Those of us who watched the building of the Soviet Navy from its humble beginnings as a coastal defense force after World War II to a powerful bluewater navy noticed long ago that the old proverb was true, even when it came to building submarines.

We knew that the Soviets did not follow our practice in building submarines; they did not incorporate edge-of-technology items in series-production models. And we saw Soviets building double-hull submarines long after we had discovered that the modern single-hull design had many advantages over the double hull, among them an improved speed/horsepower ratio. While the US Navy leaped decades ahead in submarine design, the Soviets plodded along by improving tried technologies. Our submarines not only looked better, they were better.

Yet the Soviets seemed satisfied with evolutionary advances in submarine design. Many US intelligence analysts were sure that the Soviets were never going to “put all their eggs into one basket.” Soviet society punishes failure; designing high-risk submarines does not enhance one's career.

It took infinite patience to fit this miscellany into the ALFA assessment. Although it was a difficult challenge, it was a task in which most intelligence analysts excel.


Phase One

This was the consensus of Western intelligence analysts, at least until one pleasant day in 1969 when strollers walking along the Neva River saw a modern-looking, small submarine tied up at the fitting-out quay at Leningrad’s old Sudomekh Submarine Shipyard. It looked as if the submarine had just been launched from the old diesel submarine assembly shed. The assembly shed had seen little activity since the last Foxtrot-class diesel attack submarine had been launched there several years earlier. Naval analysts, following tradition and basing their analysis on previous launch histories, initially classified the submarine as a modern diesel-electric follow-on to a Foxtrot.

Further fitting-out activity, however, soon convinced at least one senior submarine analyst, Herb Lord, that this submarine was an SSN, a nuclear-powered attack submarine. It had a superbly streamlined hull and an overall length of about 79 meters.[1] Engineering calculations gave it a surfaced displacement of some 2,600 tons,[2] with a submerged displacement of about 3,700 tons.[3] Aside from the exceptionally streamlined hull form, this submarine had several other highly unusual features:

· In 1969, it was the world's smallest SSN.

· It had, a rather high reserve buoyancy—a safety factor—of nearly 30 percent, in contrast to 8 to 11 percent for US SSNs.

The submarine received the NATO classification ALFA Class SSN. Lord, an experienced photointerpreter, alerted others to concentrate their efforts on the ALFA’s construction and fitting-out pattern. The analysts noticed something they had never seen be- fore, a “highly reflective” pressure hull section near the ALFA assembly area.

Lord then requested that he be point of contact for all reports that mentioned “highly reflective” or unusually colored submarine parts. During some eight years of examining photos of Soviet submarine construction yards, analysts assembled a construction history of a magnitude never before accomplished.

Periodically, and with ever increasing frequency, Lord received reports of “highly reflective” pressure hull sections associated with the ALFA fitting out at Sudomekh. Later, he also received reports of highly reflective pieces of hull sections, similar to those of the Sudomekh ALFA, at the Severodvinsk Submarine Construction Yard, far to the north of Leningrad.[4] He noted that these two yards were connected by an inland waterway, and he wondered whether both yards could be building this rather unusual class of attack submarine.

Lord subsequently conducted what is generally known as “look-back” analysis. All reports of “highly reflective” submarine hull sections at the two construction sites were collated, reviewed, and once again evaluated. It was a formidable, time consuming task. There were reports of changes to the external appearance of the assembly halls; reports dealing with unusual submarine parts at storage sites near the halls; and reports on unusual railroad cars, tank cars, and increased production of titanium sponge. All were scrutinized. It took infinite patience to fit this miscellany into the ALFA submarine assessment. Although it was a most difficult challenge, it was a task in which most intelligence analysts excel.

After reviewing all the evidence and after long discussions with his fellow intelligence analysts, and with naval designers, engineers, and others in the Intelligence Community, Lord became even more convinced that the Soviets were indeed building a “special” type of super submarine, the first made of titanium alloy. Eventually, he concluded that he had to convince the US Navy that the Soviets were series-producing a highly modern, unusual SSN that, if fitted with advanced weapons, could seriously threaten US and allied naval operations.

Some analysts at CIA and the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) agreed. In fact. CIA had, as early as 1971, published analysis—Use of Titanium by the Soviet Shipbuilding Industry—that strongly supported the assessment that the otherwise conservative Soviets had conducted serious, long-time research on shaping and welding heavy titanium plates, and that they had in fact developed that capability.


Lord tired to prove that the Soviets had moved from their usual submarine building methods, and that they had combined several advanced technologies in a single class of submarine.

Others were skeptical. They thought that the shaping and welding of heavy titanium hull sections, especially in the generally “dirty” shipyard atmosphere, was impractical, if not impossible. This, too, was a totally reasonable assessment, because titanium cannot be welded when exposed to air; welds have to be shielded, usually by argon gas. The consensus was that the Soviets could weld small parts of titanium, such as those for aircraft or missiles, in hermetically sealed chambers, but that it was impossible to weld huge submarine pressure hull sections.

Lord, however, could not be deterred. For nine years, he would be in the center of the battle over the “titanium submarine.” During the early 1960s, little reliable, high-level scientific and technical information was available, and Lord had to rely heavily on photographic intelligence.

Lord remained certain that the collective evidence overwhelmingly supported his assessment of ALFA’s titanium alloy pressure hull. He tried to convince the US Navy that the Soviets” research and development had advanced to such a degree that they were able to build submarines made of light-weight titanium alloy, and that their SSN would be able to dive deeper than any of our SSNs. In addition, a nonmagnetic titanium submarine would be most difficult to detect.

He tried to prove that the Soviets had moved from their usual submarine building methods, and that they had combined several advanced technologies in a single class of submarine:

· A highly advanced, and possibly risky, pressure hull material (titanium alloy).

· An as-yet unknown, high-density nuclear power plant (high power concentration in a small hull).

· Possible automation to reduce the size of the crew.

It was an entirely unbelievable story.

The assessment was critical for US ship, submarine, and underwater sensor and weapon designers. After almost eight years of debate with Navy decisionmakers, Lord retired. He died a few years later, his enormous research effort never properly recognized by Naval Intelligence.

Phase Two

In a functional reorganization in Naval Intelligence the analysis of foreign submarines was divided into ballistic and cruise missile submarines, and attack diesel and nuclear attack submarines. The attack submarines were my responsibility, and in 1978 I became the ALFA Project Officer.

I agreed completely with Lord’s analysis. Now it became my mission to convince the US Navy that the Soviets were building high-threat submarines using advanced construction technology. Also in 1978, CIA sponsored a meeting of intelligence analysts, naval engineers, metallurgists, and submarine designers to discuss the “enigma” in Soviet submarine construction.

The US submarine community could not accept any possibility that the Soviets could series-produce such a sophisticated submarine.

The great majority agreed that the “highly reflective” parts were submarine components. Most were certain that the components were not of conventional submarine steel. One expert presented several dozen formulae collected from published matter freely available to any serious researcher. He believed these open sources proved conclusively that titanium alloys dissolve in sea water. There were a few who suggested the whole “Sudomekh show” could have been a large-scale “disinformation” program, and that the highly reflective components were just parts covered with aluminum paint.

Many leading metallurgists still believed it probably was impossible for the Soviets to have developed the capability to bend, shape, and weld thick titanium plates in a shipyard environment. The US submarine community, “the Rickover people,” was happy with this assessment. It could not accept any possibility that the Soviets could series-produce such a sophisticated submarine.

These expert opinions made the ALFA submarine assessment inconclusive. On the one hand, I had the expert naysayers; on the other, I had some admirals asking, “What the hell are the Russians doing?”

Lord had rejected aluminum, stainless steel, and glass fibers. There remained the HY80, HY 100, or possibly HY130 steels, and titanium. Except for stainless steel—steel turns a dark, almost black color when exposed to the elements for extended periods. I still agreed with Lord’s analysis that a titanium alloy was the most logical material suitable for submarine pressure hulls.

As analysis continued, I perceived five essential problem areas, which I called “enigmas.” These made life difficult because they challenged traditional beliefs about the very nature of Soviet submarine construction.

· First Enigma: An apparent change in Soviet design and construction methodology.

Advantage: Long-range gain.

Disadvantage: Large investment of resources.

Remarks: If successful, Soviet submarine designers and builders were making a quantum leap into modern technology.

· Second Enigma: Use of titanium alloy in pressure hull construction.

Advantage: Titanium is stronger and weighs 33 percent less than steel; the pressure hull can be stronger without increasing displacement; its use gives a submarine a stronger hull for greater diving depth and increases resistance to explosives at lesser depths; and the submarine is essentially nonmagnetic, thus decreasing the likelihood of magnetic anomaly detection (MAD).

Disadvantage: Titanium is three to five times more expensive than steel; it needs a totally different manufacturing process; shipyard workers must be retrained; construction halls must be reconfigured; and bending and shaping of heavy plates of titanium alloy are far more difficult compared to steel.

Remarks: Much evidence had been gathered that the Soviet Navy had ample research and development funds and that Soviet metallurgists had made remarkable advances in titanium manufacturing technology. Reports indicated that the Soviet Navy had conducted research in HY 100 steel, aluminum, glass fiber, and titanium alloys for use in ship and submarine construction.

· Third Enigma: Apparent use of liquid metal reactor coolants.

Advantage: Better horsepower to weight/volume ratio for higher speed.

Disadvantage: The US Navy believed that a reactor cooled by liquid metal is less safe than the pressurized water reactor (PWR) in use by the US Navy.

Remarks: The US Navy’s safety record supported the PWR approach.

· Fourth Enigma: Seemingly large-scale use of automation and reduction of crew size.

Advantage: Reduced the size of the boat and the size of its crew; lessened demand for electric power requirements; and relieved crew from mundane tasks, thus eliminating human errors caused by fatigue and boredom.

Disadvantage: The US Navy believed automated controls to be less safe than hands-on control functions.

Remarks: Only by automating many control functions could the Soviets reduce the size of the submarine. This increased the ALFA’s survivability in combat, because it became a smaller active-sonar target. Furthermore, the low magnetic signature from a nonmagnetic titanium hull made localization of target by MAD difficult. Having unmanned engineering spaces also reduced personnel casualties should the liquid metal reactor malfunction.

· Fifth Enigma: Large rescue sphere in ALFA sail indicative of strong concern for crew survivability.

Advantage: Provides safe exit for entire crew from maximum depth without external assistance. When the sphere is on the surface, it becomes a lifeboat; it protects the crew from the elements; and it has sufficient communications, emergency rations, and first aid on board.

Disadvantage: Increases weight of the submarine.

Remarks: The ALFA’s high reserve buoyancy, as well as a sophisticated rescue system, implied Soviet Navy concern for crew survivability. There were other indicators: the Soviet Navy had one India class submarine rescue submarine each in Northern and Pacific fleet areas, had several “hard” compartments in submarines, and now had fitted a sophisticated survival system in the ALFA. This was another item that did not square with our view that the Soviets had little concern for human life.

I believed that different collection assets had to be activated to convince the US Navy of a serious threat to our submarines.

From Same article
We knew that the Soviets did not follow our practice in building submarines; they did not incorporate edge-of-technology items in series-production models. And we saw Soviets building double-hull submarines long after we had discovered that the modern single-hull design had many advantages over the double hull, among them an improved speed/horsepower ratio. While the US Navy leaped decades ahead in submarine design, the Soviets plodded along by improving tried technologies. Our submarines not only looked better, they were better.
Unravelling a Cold War Mystery — Central Intelligence Agency
 
At least there are six PAK-FA's today. That's a start. What do we have with AMCA? ASQR's?

Why so? If we pen down the deal for FGFA this year or next then development shouldn't take more than 10 years max.


Airforce version PAK-FA, not Naval one.

You cannot put PAK-FA on a Carrier. And as of now even primary specifications of N-FGFA ,or even plan of having one, has not been decided by any Navy, including Russians.Even if Russians start from today, they won't be in a position to induct N-FGFA in their Navy before end of next decade.

Even for FGFA/PAK-FA , Russia would have only 12 Aircraft by 2020. Mass production of Airforce version of FGFA itself would start after 2025, forget about Naval version.Apart from that, Russians do not have experience of building CATOBAR aircraft,and they cannot ask for help from USA or France.


N-FGFA is in same condition as N- AMCA ie as Fanboy concept. And given that we could access consultant help from US and French, we would probably make a CATOBAR plane faster than Russia, if geopolitical situation does not change.

If today we decide that design a CATOBAR N-AMCA, we won't be any worse situation that Ruskies would be in case of CATOBAR N-FGFA.

Why so? If we pen down the deal for FGFA this year or next then development shouldn't take more than 10 years max.

10 year is for Airforce version.Even most optimistic estimates project that we would not get first FGFA before 2022.This when preliminary design of FGFA has been agreed upon.

Naval version does not exist even as concept. In STOBAR configuration, it could come in 15 years, but for CATOBAR , be sure it would take two decades from this point.

At any rate, PRODUCING N-FGFA with full control over spares, source codes and frequencies is far better option BUYING Faltu-35 with EUMA which is basically stuffed with open-sourced stuff because we didn't sign in CISMOA to get the 'ally-grade' stuff.

Faltu-35 is only Fifth generation Naval Aircraft today, and would remain only one till 2030.
 
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I dont go be the speculation.

:disagree::rofl::rofl::rofl:This is hilarious!!!

Another GEM from you!!!


My dear friend how can you convert 3-4kMT Diesel Sub(This is Max for Diesel and India has already 8kMT Arihant) to 15kMT SSBN/SSN???? (Next generation Subs are going to be 12kMT+).
the heaviest diesel sub is soryu class, which is less than 3kt.

how about co development of sub with Israelis? When ariel Sharon visited india in 2003 he proposed such offer. Now we are in a position to design and develop N-subs and with there high-tech gadgets we can develop a high end SSN (It may not be related this discussion)
 
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Struggled for decade?

Check your facts first, Arihant was sanctioned in 1999,
the construction of reactor started in 2003 and goes critical in 2007. How India struggled?
I cant give link since I am on phone but google gentleseas.blogspot.in

Also it was announced during Modi's visit to Paris that France will assist India in building nuclear reactors for subs.Why would India need help if its not struggling?
 
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