Official Pentagon report reveals U.S military "shocked" by Israel's conduct in Shujaiyya

[The SC]

So who is firing the rockets from the Gaza strip side? That makes it clearly a war.

And what does a "majority civilian population" mean? That means just about every country or area in the world!

That is a minimum one can do, when undersiege or being attacked, it is called self-defense, but it is barely a self-defense in this case, it is more of a disturbing act. Self defense is allowed by any law of any country to defend oneself and his loved ones against aggression. In this case the agression was going on for more than 60 years.

An that is what it means, it is mainly a civilian population, look at the death and injury tolls; that would have happened to about every country or area in the world who has no army, against a well armed agressor with a three vectored army.

 

[VCheng]

That is a minimum one can do, when undersiege or being attacked, it is called self-defense, but it is barely a self-defense in this case, it is more of a disturbing act. Self defense is allowed by any law of any country to defend oneself and his loved ones against aggression. In this case the agression was going on for more than 60 years.

An that is what it means, it is mainly a civilian population, look at the death and injury tolls; that would have happened to about every country or area in the world who has no army, against a well armed agressor with a three vectored army.

There is no requirement for proportionality in war. If one is attacked, then one has the right, and indeed the duty, to respond as best as one can using all available means. The number of combatants in or out of uniform is nearly always smaller compared to a nation's or group's overall population, so I am not sure what your point is in this regard.

 

[rockstar08]

So who gave the F-16s to Pakistan? And billions of dollars in military and other aid? And to many other countries. What is your point?



Yes, war needs to be efficient wherever possible.

sir jee what is your point ??
Pakistan is not occupying someone's territory , and killing kids .. or using the f-16's on civilians ,
only one kind of Sub-humans do this , and those are Israeli

 

[VCheng]

sir jee what is your point ??
Pakistan is not occupying someone's territory , and killing kids .. or using the f-16's on civilians ,
only one kind of Sub-humans do this , and those are Israeli

Actually, Sir, Pakistan is doing ALL of those things. Please think your argument through before you proceed.

 

[rockstar08]

Actually, Sir, Pakistan is doing ALL of those things. Please think your argument through before you proceed.

Sir i would like to know .. because the Pakistan i live in probably a bit different from your"s

 

[VCheng]

Sir i would like to know .. because the Pakistan i live in probably a bit different from your"s

No, I will let you figure that one out on your own since there is only one Pakistan.

 

[TankMan]

Actually, Sir, Pakistan is doing ALL of those things. Please think your argument through before you proceed.

No, its not. Kashmir is a disputed territory and has a fair amount of autonomy (atleast Azad Kashmir). Pakistan is not "occupying" any other territory.
Pakistan has not massacred children and no one claims that, not even Indian media. Neither are they bombing civilians.
Whatever your views of Israel and Palestine are, that's fine with me but please refrain from lying and making such baseless accusations without a shred of proof.

 

[VCheng]

No, its not. Kashmir is a disputed territory and has a fair amount of autonomy (atleast Azad Kashmir). Pakistan is not "occupying" any other territory.
Pakistan has not massacred children and no one claims that, not even Indian media. Neither are they bombing civilians.
Whatever your views of Israel and Palestine are, that's fine with me but please refrain from lying and making such baseless accusations without a shred of proof.

I will not respond since it would take this thread off topic, but I will politely suggest that you should look at what is actually happening out there before you fly off the handle.

 

[TankMan]

I will not respond since it would take this thread off topic, but I will politely suggest that you should look at what is actually happening out there before you fly off the handle.

I would politely suggest that you give me a link or any form of proof to back your claims. If you don't want to go off topic, please make a new thread about it

 

[VCheng]

I would politely suggest that you give me a link or any form of proof to back your claims. If you don't want to go off topic, please make a new thread about it (or PM me the links)

As I have said in this thread before, suffice to say that ALL wars are dirty business, no matter who is fighting it. That should be enough.

 

[TankMan]

As I have said in this thread before, suffice to say that ALL wars are dirty business, no matter who is fighting it. That should be enough.

Wars are dirty business, but war crimes are worse. Collateral damage happens, but one has to admit that what Israel is doing is wrong and that they have done the same before Hamas ever existed. Most of the Palestinians' demands are perfectly reasonable and If Israel wanted, they could solve this issue peacefully.

As for Pakistan, they are fighting a legitimate war against insurgents (The Taliban) which are condemned by the whole world. Furthermore, Pakistan is not illegally occupying anyone yet you claim they are. Atleast clarify this.

 

[VCheng]

Wars are dirty business, but war crimes are worse. Collateral damage happens, but one has to admit that what Israel is doing is wrong and that they have done the same before Hamas ever existed. Most of the Palestinians' demands are perfectly reasonable and If Israel wanted, they could solve this issue peacefully.

As for Pakistan, they are fighting a legitimate war against insurgents (The Taliban) which are condemned by the whole world. Furthermore, Pakistan is not illegally occupying anyone yet you claim they are. Atleast clarify this.

For Israel, the war is just as legitimate as it is for Pakistan. Or, put another way, what Pakistan is doing is the same as what Israel is doing. Or, put another way, there is no difference at the heart of it all in both situations.

 

[TankMan]

For Israel, the war is just as legitimate as it is for Pakistan. Or, put another way, what Pakistan is doing is the same as what Israel is doing. Or, put another way, there is no difference at the heart of it all in both situations.

I strongly disagree, as Israel is illegally occupying territories that don't belong to it and has violated dozens of UN resolutions regarding this issue. There is no way the Waziristan insurgency (or any other issue in Pakistan) can be compared to Israel's occupation of Palestine.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Things could have been a lot worse. The US has limits as to what we will sell (even to the Israelis). Just think of what could happen with an overflight of B52's.

One plane:

 

[VCheng]

I strongly disagree, as Israel is illegally occupying territories that don't belong to it and has violated dozens of UN resolutions regarding this issue. There is no way the Waziristan insurgency (or any other issue in Pakistan) can be compared to Israel's occupation of Palestine.

You are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. And the Israelis to theirs. And so on.