JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

[Deino]

As I said. You kids are naive.
Light aircraft often carry extra internal fuel at various areas.
Blk 1 first batch aircraft also received extra fuel during first major overhaul.
View attachment 773310

Sorry in case I misread something, but you don't want us to make believe there is a fuel tank in the sides under the canopy?

 

[The Raven]

Sorry in case I misread something, but you don't want us to make believe there is a fuel tank in the sides under the canopy?

Yes he does Deino, that's the scary thing...this guy actually believes that behind every green panel is fuel! I mean have you seen anything as ridiculous as this before!?

 

[iLION12345_1]

As I said. You kids are naive.
Light aircraft often carry extra internal fuel at various areas.
Blk 1 first batch aircraft also received extra fuel during first major overhaul.
View attachment 773310

There are things both supporting and negating this, but I feel in the thunders case it is true that SOME of the green indicates fuel, however, not ALL green indicates fuel (as in, it’s being used to indicate multiple things):

1. Some areas that are green seem unlikely to have fuel, like the edges of the rear horizontal stabilizers and some areas under the aircraft near the landing gear doors.
2. This green color is also used on other Chinese aircraft when they are in this form and on them it’s definitely not being used to show fuel, or At least not only fuel, as many small pieces here and there that are either housing sensors or simply can’t store fuel (like the intakes) are colored green.
3. If you look at the block one and the green material on it, then it seems like the thing has basically no fuel storage, both the under and upper side of the wings aren’t green, much of the spine isn’t green Etc etc, all of which is seen in later blocks and rebuilt JF-17s. Did it really have that little fuel? Wouldn’t we see a massive increase in advertised range then?
4. It seems a bit unlikely there would be fuel right under the cockpit, it just sounds like a safety and fire hazard, however it is somewhat possible if they think it’s safe enough and gives them a good enough advantage.

But going off what the PAF personnel say and the general areas that are green, it can be assumed that the green parts at least on the spine and above/below the wings are fuel (and maybe composite as well) And the rest can indicate sensor positions or more composites. As the PAF personnel may just be meaning that the green material in the specific area he points to is fuel. I also wouldn’t take his word as final, as he likely doesn’t know or isn’t telling everything about the aircraft, it’s possible he‘s generalizing.

 

[The Raven]

As I said. You kids are naive.
Light aircraft often carry extra internal fuel at various areas.
Blk 1 first batch aircraft also received extra fuel during first major overhaul.
View attachment 773310

So let me get this right, the fuel capacity in overhaul aircraft has increased? By how much?

 

[Deino]

So let me get this right, the fuel capacity in overhaul aircraft has increased? By how much?

The question must be not "By how much?" but "How?"

How do you add a fuel tank on the sides of a cockpit, in fact an area that is normally already not a voluminous area and even more such a tank would change the centre of gravity, flight performance ...

I slowly want to ask in return, @Dazzler, what are your credentials?

 

[Vortex]

View attachment 773219


So... .what's that under the wing?

I feel some tense situation here so just trying to make situation a less tense between members…

So what’s under the wings ?

—-> Humara teen balagh ho gaya hey yaar

 

[Dazzler]

The question must be not "By how much?" but "How?"

How do you add a fuel tank on the sides of a cockpit, in fact an area that is normally already not a voluminous area and even more such a tank would change the centre of gravity, flight performance ...

I slowly want to ask in return, @Dazzler, what are your credentials?

You sure you wanna take a dig on me?

 

[MAB]

Reading the last few pages, I can conclude these fancy forum titles mean absolutely nothing. So much nonsense being spewed and things being stated as if they are fact and not someone's imagination.

 

[ssethii]

Take it or leave it nobody is shoving it down your throat. Nobody will reveal his identity or sources just to satisfy somebody's inflated ego. All the changes are under the skin and that's known since the update was announced. It's nobody's fault despite knowing this fanboys still expect to see a super-duper beefed up stealthy version to be unveiled. It ain't going to happen and that's why we have project Azm to induct the next generation of fighters in our inventory. Having said that there are few unexpected subtle changes on the outside too in B-III that only a few knowledgeable people will be able to spot and appreciate.

 

[Dazzler]

So let me get this right, the fuel capacity in overhaul aircraft has increased? By how much?

So let me get this right, the fuel capacity in overhaul aircraft has increased? By how much?

Can be done if structure has room and can endure the weight. Gripens internal fuel has been expanded at least twice. C version

 

[Dazzler]

Yes he does Deino, that's the scary thing...this guy actually believes that behind every green panel is fuel! I mean have you seen anything as ridiculous as this before!?

Reflects a petty mind.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Green is just composites and does not indicate fuel cells. Just Google the lastest pictures of F-15 in primer to get an idea.

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images.app.goo.gl

As the use of composites has increased in the production, we have seen more of these green colored panels on the aircraft. Hopefully the horizontal and vertical stabilizers will also be made of composites before long.

Unrelated but an interesting history of composite use in aircraft. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FBAWegQIAxAB&usg=AOvVaw3Ru9L0HvSDQMjIHIOUQv5U

 

[Deino]

You sure you wanna take a dig on me?

No, but you quite clearly told me that in your opinion my credentials are less worth, irrelevant or whatever ... as such I think I have at least the same right to ask you the same and since I told you mine, you should be so honest to do the same at least as per mutual respect?

Can be done if structure has room and can endure the weight. Gripens internal fuel has been expanded at least twice. C version
View attachment 773319

But surely not in the side-walls of the cockpit!

 

[messiach]

All the observations are consequent deduction of higher AsR. The change in wing clearance is a apparent masquerading effect. Videos would make the point clear.

Dear @messiach and just as a pretext to this post, I would like to note that I don't want to offend you in any way, I admire your knowledge, I'm more than glad you are back but during the last few weeks, I have some serious issues and this post is a prime-example!

Please explain, where you see a "higher aspect ratio - for lift and maintained endurance" on the wings or any of these details that allegedly "have been optimised to reduce drag which induces an apparent change in wing clearance" and even more changes on the "mid fuselage is smaller as rootlets expanded ... posterior fuselage looks a bit smaller in a diff"! Please show it by comparison with other suitable images of regular Block 2 JF-17s or at least mark it on an image so that we can check for our-self.

In fact - and I'm quite sure several other members here too - see NOTHING, I see no major new wing with wider span, a different and especially not higher aspect ratio or greater ground-clearance, I see no major changes on the fuselage, which would allow a conclusion towards a different engine, higher mass-flow or whatever. Please don't interpret this as ignorance or arrogance or bias, maybe it is a lack of technical understanding, lack of eye-sight or whatever or indeed your knowledge, but PLEASE explain it since at least I truly want to see and believe it, most of all since such major changes at least IMO make no sense. A new wing, a different, redesigned fuselage, a taller gear and so on are no minor changes like an added RWR ow MAWS and as noted I neither see any visible changes nor a reason for such a major redesign, since it would require additional time consuming tests and certification.

Again, please don't take this post as an offence or critic, but only as a desperate request for more information and proof since I want to lean, otherwise any such claim will still remain as mysterious and unbelievable for some here like claims the PAF will get J-15, J-16 and J-20.

Kind regards,
Deino

@Akh1112

 

[messiach]

Simple. Its a ratio of wing span vs mean chord length. Its a rough assessment but not off target.
Rotation lockpins, cyl & piston on download steering actuator of gear is shorter.

Wouldnt you need the top view to comment about aspect ratio?

So why dont you explain to us how the pictures show that the landing gear is stronger and the wings longer?