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Our F16s and the Indian Predicament Spanning Nearly Four Decades.

Events of Feb 27 happened too quickly and IAF wasn't prepared. It's as simple as that. It's not like we had dozens of planes in the area but we deliberately sent 4 ancient Migs to battle it out with the PAF. That is all we could arrange in that time and that is due to the ill preparedness of the IAF.

Ok. Fair. Next time will send you legal notice 1 month prior events like what occurred on the 27th Feb.

Would it be fair enough ? Because you would have one full month to be prepared...:omghaha:
 
During the wars of 1965 and 1971 PAF though outnumbered gave a bloody nose to its numerically superior enemy. The feat bestowed by a handful of our professionals left a scar on the ego of our giant neighbour for many decades to come. In 1979 ACM Anwar Shamin initiated the Project Falcon to evaluate,negotiate and procure the F16s from the US. This news came as a BOMBSHELL for the Indians.Never in the history of mankind a neighbour manifolds bigger in size and strength Whined,moaned,cried and begged to stop these machines to be delivered to PAF from day one. The irony is that this saga still continues with full whimper as we speak.
Guilty of her role in the East Pakistan fiasco,Indira Gandhi was the first Indian leader to start a never ending crusade against the F16s. She made countless pleas to the US,from that time the Indian caucus in the US Congress led by Stephen Solarz was fully active. The US initially refused to sell the F16s and offered us F5Es,F20s and even A7 Corsairs. Sighting our indispensability in the Afghan theater they offered PAF a scale down version of F16 with a J79 engine.
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PAF strongly opposed this offer and requested F16 block 15 with an F100-PW-200 engine.
Finally US relented and a letter of agreement for up to 28 F-16A and 12 F-16B was signed December 1981,with delivery scheduled for January 1983.The first F-16 arriving at PAF Base Mushaff on 15 January 1983 was flown by Squadron Leader Shahid Javed.
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On the first delivery the paranoia and hysteria exhibited by India was unimaginable. Indira Gandhi was running around the globe like a headless chicken. In the end to counter our 40 F16s India ended up buying 400 aircrafts of numerous origins. From Mirage 2000s,jaguars,Mig 23/25/27s,Harriers and others.Below Indira Gandhi meeting with French President Francois Mitterrand for Mirage 2000s.
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In the late eighties PAF requested another 60 F16s under peace gate 3,eleven were built by 1990. This time India succeeded in lobbying,the Pressler amendment was passed the U.S. placed sanctions and an arms embargo on Pakistan on 6 October 1990 due to the country's continued nuclear weapons programme.All eleven Peace Gate III F-16s, along with 7 F-16A and 10 F-16B of the 60 Peace Gate IV F-16s, which had been built by the end of 1994 were embargoed and put into storage in the United States.
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The time between 1987 to 2005 PAF was deprived of the F16s, during this period IAF procured further high tech aircrafts including the Su30 MKIs and Mig 29s in big numbers to counter the PAFs dwindling F16s. In 2001 the war on terror came as a blessing in disguise from 2006 the US started supplying us 14 F16s under EDA with further 18 block 52s under peace drive 1 along with some Jordanian F16s.
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Naturally the Indians opposed the deal vehemently again,even with PAF operating only a handful of high tech aircrafts ,the Indian sense of inferiority complex was prevalent in every nook and corner of the capitol Hill. Nevertheless PAF also managed to upgrade its ageing fleet courtesy uncle Sam.
Boisterous with its numerical and technical superiority the enemy tried to challenge our professionals again, but ended up being humiliated as usual.
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For just one aircraft (F16) the Indians tried every trick in their bag,from obstructing to purchasing every possible high tech aircraft available in the world. So far their Mirages,MIGs,Jaguars,Sukhois and others have all failed to subdue our KNIGHTS.Their last hope and prayers are resting on the RAFALEs.
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Judging by the history it is not difficult to conclude who will emerge VICTORIOUS again.:pakistan:

Very true of F16.

IAF would not be what it is today if paf had gone for F4 instead of F16.

Paf could not have pulled off feb26 without F16 - amraam combo.
 
US is jumping up and down to sell India F-16s but seems like India is not interested.
Indian shortsightedness in the matters of its defense.

My observation is that your country is growing complacent in the matters of security. YOU are taking both Pakistan and China for granted in your security calculus, and the professionalism of your armed forces is increasingly questionable at present. Some of your defense analysts - who understand the bigger picture - have openly asserted that India is no longer prepared for a major war with either Pakistan or China. Your choice and call.

Ok. Fair. Next time will send you legal notice 1 month prior events like what occurred on the 27th Feb.

Would it be fair enough ? Because you would have one full month to be prepared...:omghaha:
Hahaha

Like seriously? Whose fault is it if IAF isn't 'prepared' for any eventuality at any point in time?

By the way, one needs to define "preparation."
 
Yes, it was a poor performance but it was one day and it was a skirmish, not even a battle. And IAF was heavily outnumbered by PAF. You can read as much into it as you like but most international observers aren't. In fact, i believe that the IAF got a much needed wake up call at a very small price.

I do believe that the air force is our weakest military arm and your air force is your strongest. To be fair, I have also read from most neutral sources that the PAF did give IAF a bloody nose in 1965 war... but 1971 really ? I am sure that even most Pakistani analysts would agree that 1971 was a complete defeat for Pakistan including the PAF.
one saber squadron in the east gave a bloody noose to whole IAF ...... in the end PAF destroyed their aircrafts themselves........... we have always owned the skies ............
 
Yes, it was a poor performance but it was one day and it was a skirmish, not even a battle. And IAF was heavily outnumbered by PAF. You can read as much into it as you like but most international observers aren't. In fact, i believe that the IAF got a much needed wake up call at a very small price.

I do believe that the air force is our weakest military arm and your air force is your strongest. To be fair, I have also read from most neutral sources that the PAF did give IAF a bloody nose in 1965 war... but 1971 really ? I am sure that even most Pakistani analysts would agree that 1971 was a complete defeat for Pakistan including the PAF.
IAF lost 57 aircraft to enemy action in 1971. PAF lost 24. Despite the odds.
 
IAF was too high on modafinil on 26th in order to counter a PAF response then their flight surgeons gave them relaxants to sleep it off.

PAF trolled them and hit them in broad daylight on 27th.

So much for a two front war.

I always laugh when their media writes all the technical jargon BS.

The reality is much different than their modafinil fueled hallucinations.
 
Talking about Pakistani propaganda . Man O man ..... This lad here seems to be viewing this forum from glasses of sheer patriotism . Don't talk about Pakistani propaganda when you know what you guys do .

Not a "Lad" they are still sensible, but a "laddie"
 
To be honest the way IAF has performed in February this year, you have lost all bragging rights as far as airforce is concerned

Like they ever had any!!!

PAF still managed to perform very well in 1971. You can go and read about it. I won;t say it was as good as 1965 but it was better in 3 services

Overall it was a debacle. Yes

PS: It sounds funny when you say you got outnumbered by PAF in February

We gave India a bloody nose in '71 despite grounding a good part of the PAF due to mutinies (Bengali Crew, Officers and Pilots).
 
IAF was too high on modafinil on 26th in order to counter a PAF response then their flight surgeons gave them relaxants to sleep it off.

PAF trolled them and hit them in broad daylight on 27th.

So much for a two front war.

I always laugh when their media writes all the technical jargon BS.

The reality is much different than their modafinil fueled hallucinations.

India in a no holds war will try to incapacitate paf assets with missiles like brahmos on the ground.
 
India in a no holds war will try to incapacitate paf assets with missiles like brahmos on the ground.

Day dreaming is good at least to make you guys feel better in a fantasy world.
Just like kids; choosing among different lollypops to figure out which one is better. Keep guessing and choosing; suddenly another surprise will come.
 
India in a no holds war will try to incapacitate paf assets with missiles like brahmos on the ground.

Sure man. How many have you got to cover all assets?

Asset disbursal is practiced for that same reason. We have plenty of strips and back up motorway strips available to disburse our inventory.

BTW range of brahmos is dependent upon flight profile so do expect a counterstrike especially if you are hoping for lo-lo strike.

Just because we don't advertise our SOW weapons does not mean that we don't have adequate SOW and cruise missiles.

PAF will also be using all assets to make sure that maximum enemy assets are destroyed on ground.

Lessons from gulf war 1 are enough to give us an idea w.r.t the air war intensity needed in first few days.

PAF practices considering all the numerical superiority factors of IAF.
 
Very true of F16.

IAF would not be what it is today if paf had gone for F4 instead of F16.

Paf could not have pulled off feb26 without F16 - amraam combo.
I wouldn't be too sure our jf 17 is a very capable machine
 
The first Pakistani to fly F 16 was MM Alam
He was sent to evaluate the F-16 but Shahid Latif landed with first F-16 in Pakistan.

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TEXAS (Fort Worth): In Dec. 1981, Air Commodore M. M. ALAM visited General Dynamics facilities here. Photo shows him at controls of F-16 Fighting Falcon with a GD test pilot in the rear seat.
M. M. ALAM, who had been called ‘flying virtuoso’ by a leading US aviation magazine, had test flown F-16 at Fort Worth.

 

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