RAFALE'S MINI ENCYLOPEDIA FOR IT'S FANBOYZ

[sancho]

Indo-French love story seems to be in full swing!!

Hope Rafale deal could be signed then.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Hope Rafale deal could be signed then.

Fingers crossed buddy!! Areva deal would be cherry on the top!

I'm wondering whether the Rafale deal will be signed during this visit or during the days before AI 2013 which I heard was a possiblity.

 

[sancho]

Fingers crossed buddy!! Areva deal would be cherry on the top!

I'm wondering whether the Rafale deal will be signed during this visit or during the days before AI 2013 which I heard was a possiblity.

I think the biggest chance is his visit, since there is nothing more official, than his and MMS signature under the contract. I also guess we might here more about the final content of Mirage upgrade when the Rafale deal is signed, since there could be similarities wrt weapons procurements for example (Scalp and SPICE).
The only sad point is, that currently nothing hints on more commonality between Rafale and LCA MK2, or Rafale and AMCA the way I would have prefered it. The Rafale deal as a whole is such a big chance for us, to get way more, but I think MoD is too shortsighted again and blinded by ADAs and DRDOs hope to deal with things alone again.

 

[Abingdonboy]

I think the biggest chance is his visit, since there is nothing more official, than his and MMS signature under the contract. I also guess we might here more about the final content of Mirage upgrade when the Rafale deal is signed, since there could be similarities wrt weapons procurements for example (Scalp and SPICE).
The only sad point is, that currently nothing hints on more commonality between Rafale and LCA MK2, or Rafale and AMCA the way I would have prefered it. The Rafale deal as a whole is such a big chance for us, to get way more, but I think MoD is too shortsighted again and blinded by ADAs and DRDOs hope to deal with things alone again.

Surely the Rafale tech for LCA and especially AMCA is still a high possibility once this Ralafe deal is signed and ToT trickles down? Once all parties have got things cleared up then sensible decisions can be made.

I am looking foreward to the nitty-gritty details of the Ralafe contract though ie what HMDS, who wil be providing certain infrastructure/logistic services in India, weapons package, IAF training etc however I feel I'll have to wait months if not years for most of these details.

 

[Abingdonboy]

@sancho

What do you think the deciding factor will be between the Damacles vs Litning LDP debate for the IAF vis a vis the Rafale? Cost or capabiltiy? And has there been a particularly intensive comparison of the two?

 

[sancho]

Surely the Rafale tech for LCA and especially AMCA is still a high possibility once this Ralafe deal is signed and ToT trickles down? Once all parties have got things cleared up then sensible decisions can be made.

No, could have linked this all together to 1 big deal, instead of making it more complicated by several smaller deals later, which also delays everything.

If I would be in charge from the Indian side, I would have done it like this:

Phase 1 (arround 2015) - Rafale F3+ by Dassault / LCA MK2 by HAL

- both fighters with same HMS, RBE 2 AESA radar, FSO including new IRST (either new developed, or if possible take by EF or Russians), DDM NG MAWS


Phase 2 (around 2018) - Licence production of futher developed and customised Rafale by HAL for IAF and Dassault for French forces

- (integrated) PDL NG, software upgrades, METEOR missile, SPECTRA GaN, possibly a jointly developed MICA IR repacement, Indian CAS weapons, CFTs and if possible Kaveri-Snecma K10


Phase 3 (between 2020 and 2025 onwards) - joint developments on Rafale MLU and a naval AMCA based on Rafale M

- GaN RBE 2 AESA with electronic attack capability, conformal radar arrays, stealth shapings with internal weapon bays / weapon pods, SPECTRA NG with improved electronic attack capabilities, Astra NG with Ramjet propulsion for Indian Rafales and AMCA


The point is, we can bind Dassault, Thales, Snecma and the French in general now to increased partnerships with India on an eye to eye level, because of the huge Rafale order that is possible and since we still are the best chance to export the fighter so far!
For us the joint developments will help to improve our industrial capabilities, while the common techs and capabilities will help to finish LCA and AMCA projects way earlier!

@sancho

What do you think the deciding factor will be between the Damacles vs Litning LDP debate for the IAF vis a vis the Rafale? Cost or capabiltiy? And has there been a particularly intensive comparison of the two?

Capabilitywise IAF will want the Litening, since it technically superior and already available and widely used in Indian forces. The Damocles XF would have been an alternative, but it was scrapped and now the French go for the long shot and PDL NG by 2018, but IAF can't wait so long, so my guess is, that they will integrate the Litening, even if the costs might be not that cheap.
The other possibility is as shown in my last post, using Damocles now as a stopgap solution and jointly develop PDL NG as part as our contribution on a partner level for 2018.

 

[shree835]

F3.3 Rafale to be commissioned in the second quarter of 2013:

Change will include:
- Improved fire control for laser guided weapons.
- Fire control for GBU 12/22/24.
- Improved air to sea fire control.
- Improved Link 16.
Le Rafale au standard F3.3 mis en service au second trimestre 2013 - Le Journal de l'Aviation

Please let me know is India going for F3.3 Rafale or lower version....?

 

[IND151]

From the best source when it comes to Rafale news!

please tell me the source

 

[sancho]

Please let me know is India going for F3.3 Rafale or lower version....?

The Rafale we get will be the F3-O4T or F3+:

Rafale News: Rafale F3-O4T and beyond


The mentioned 3.3 is more an upgrade version for French forces, than a standard of Dassault.

please tell me the source

Not sure which psot that was, but I guess it's about the Rafale news thread in the militarypotos forum and the member Olybrious that runs the thread.

 

[DrSomnath999]

Air&Cosmos Jan 18, operation Serval:

Air forces around Mali:

- Rafale reinforcements expected from 3/30 Lorraine fighter squadron, Al Dhafra, UAE.
- Sunday, 4 Rafale shot 21 GBU / AASM on targets in northern Mali. The Rafale that didn't fire 3 of its 6 AASM had a technical problem (Rafaut pylon probably).

COURTESY:OLYBRIUS
THANK U FOR THE INFO MATE

First images of Gao after the Rafale strike

COURTESY:OLYBRIUS
THANK U FOR THE PICS

 

[IND151]

The Rafale we get will be the F3-O4T or F3+:

Rafale News: Rafale F3-O4T and beyond


The mentioned 3.3 is more an upgrade version for French forces, than a standard of Dassault.




Not sure which psot that was, but I guess it's about the Rafale news thread in the militarypotos forum and the member Olybrious that runs the thread.

thanks for info

 

[GURU DUTT]

wel i have a confusion OP of all the above latest development i was wondering will India get the latest one with all the latest gizmos as the french airforce is getting or we will get the model which was was shown to us for evaluatiopn and say when it comes we get anews that the Mod has made a sepparate deal for the latest stuff kindly do clear my confusion in detail Thanks

 

[DrSomnath999]

Rafale M38, the last of a kind


The Rafale M 38 is the last Rafale M equipped with a PESA radar. Also the last Rafale M of the third batch

Rafale News: Rafale M38, the last of a kind

 

[Abingdonboy]

 

[sancho]

wel i have a confusion OP of all the above latest development i was wondering will India get the latest one with all the latest gizmos as the french airforce is getting or we will get the model which was was shown to us for evaluatiopn and say when it comes we get anews that the Mod has made a sepparate deal for the latest stuff kindly do clear my confusion in detail Thanks

The one shown during the evaluation was an F3, with an AESA demo version installed to show the capaility of the coming Rafale. We get the F3+ with the serial produced AESA and all latest upgrades + some, that we might fund (HMS, IRST, possibly Meteor and Litening). The 3.3 upgrade is more specific to French forces and has some improvovements to datalinks for example, that IAF don't use, which makes them not useful for us anyway.